Strategy Discussion: T5 > T6 changes 1st post

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Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#1 “Quote” Edit Post
T5BR to T6DR changes.

New Moves
u+1+2 ( aka \o/ ) : A double air uppercut thing. Only hits in juggles and right next to opponents. Can whiff smaller characters.

f+2: A move similar to Feng's b+1 replaces his f+2 jab. -12 on block, slight + frames on hit, knocks down right in front of him on hit (like Baek CH b+2) with nothing guaranteed.

f+1,2,2: A new string, hits mid high mid, ends in a gunshot which can be charged to an unblockable. First 2 hits NC but it doesn't jail and the 2nd hit is high. Useful in juggles. Last hit gives b+2 knockback.

d/f+3>2_WS+3>2: Side kick to elbow. m,h NC. Delayable and vey hit confirmable. Good for wall splats.

d/b+3 series: Can link into the old d/b+3,4,3,4,3,4 cossack kicks, after any kick you can do 1+2 for a high scissor attack, or d+1+2 for a crouch throw. Crouch throw is dependant on this kick it is used after. After 3 gives powerbomb, after 4 gives the toss up and shoot.

b+1,1_[1]: A gunshot type move after the b+1. 2nd hit chargable. NCc. Uninterruptible. Wall splats.

b+4>4: A mid knee to stomp. NCc. Hit leaves them in SLD. This looks to be an awesome oki move. It picks up backroll and slams down. Delayable. Only really useful in combos and oki occasionally.

f+1+2: A quick double gun shot. Gives mach breaker style knockback. His old cross cut move is f,f+1+2. Looks like a faster d/b+1+2. Useful on the wall. i15.

-d/f+1>2,1,2: New string. Hits m,h,h,h,h. 2nd hit delayable. 2nd to 3rd hit NCc. Only really useful as a B! ender. Though the d/f+1 is a great i14 poke that tracks left.

1+2,1+2: First hit is a spinning lariat type move, 2 hits and tracks both ways. Second hit is similar to d+1+2, it crushes jabs but can be interrupted by mids ~16f and faster.

b+3,2,2: A mhh kick punch punch string. First hit catches grounded slightly off axis. Good for floats and reliable B! pickup.


New Properties

-ff+1: This is now arguably his best move. Safe mid, has range now, B! on aerial hit, free d/b+2_b+3 on hit.

-A lot of his gun-type moves are chargeable. The charge generally adds range and damage and a lot of them give increased guard stun/pushback. Full charge takes ~2 seconds to charge then automatically fire. They do not track, but have good range. Here is a list of chargeable moves.
-f+1,2,[2]
-b+[2]
-d/b+[2]
-f,f+[2]
-b+1,[1]

-u/b+1+2: His old SS+1+2. His homing move, now tracks with a white vapor trail

-b+1+2 gives crumple stun on CH.

-u/f+1+2 throw has 2 new animations! Normal throw he picks them up, piston punches them in the face like 5 times then slams them down. With d,d/f+2 he throws them in the air like d/f+2+4 then punches. Still leads to wall combos and also benefits from rage. No longer can cancel with u~u/f+1+2.

-HCF+2: Crumple stun on hit. Can be followed up with f,f+3[B!], d/f+1,2,1,2.


Bind moves
-f,f+1
-f,f+3
-b+4,4
-WS+1+2,1+2

Misc.

-d/f+2, 2, 2, ff+1 B! d/f+1,2,1,2 or b+3,2,2 - New staple combo hotness.
WS+1, 2, \o/, b+4,4[B!]
f,f+2, \o/,\o/, 2, b+4,4[B!]
HCF+2, f,f+3[B!]

Low parry, b+3,2, d/f+1,2,1,2


-After breaking a floor, Jack can do 3+4 on the way down to fly. It automatically does 2 thrusts and lands on the other side of the opponent.

-His voice has been changed to a weird robot toy voice.

Last edited by Brahma on Sep 19th, 2009 at 19:01

Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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Liger 7
Iron Fist God
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1451
#2 “Quote” Edit Post
So far Jack is king shit. The customs look sexy. And good point for 1+2,1+2 both strikes hitting. If can be used as a juggle ender instead of the usual f+1+2,2 then that is sweet. You would have a more powerfull stapple juggle with the added bonus of better oki/wake up game.

Oh man I can 't wait for T6.
Signature I be comin' through like the four-nine-three-eleven...
alkanphel
Artful Dodger
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3152
PSN: <Launch+>
#3 “Quote” Edit Post
Well they didn't show us any new moves but the old moves shown in the Director's Interview vid are the ff+2, ws+1+2,1+2,1+2, b+1, ss+1 and the 2 front throws. I guessing that probably all of Jack5's moves will carry over to T6.
Signature When on a trip, even if you forget the pants, don't forget the Uno
Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#4 “Quote” Edit Post
I don't even know if they can add any new punch moves. I think all of his 1 and 2 and 1+2 commands are already occupied except for d+1 and u/f+1.

I hope he gets a rocket kick. Or at least some sort of kick move besides f,f+3 and d/b+4.
Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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Runemaster
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1398
From: Indonesia
#5 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Brahma
I don't even know if they can add any new punch moves. I think all of his 1 and 2 and 1+2 commands are already occupied except for d+1 and u/f+1.


Maybe now he'll get some sorta stance? A robot stance..?
That way they can add more punches. Afterall, his attacks are mostly done by his hands or his upper body,


I hope he gets a rocket kick. Or at least some sort of kick move besides f,f+3 and d/b+4.


And any new kick move would be good.
But his feet are kinda short....


Anyway, his 1+2,1+2 on juggle ender looks sweet.
Probably will do more damage near a wall.
SymBiosis
White Trash Paul
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 3280
From: Canada
PSN: centenza69
XBL: cenlenza
#6 “Quote” Edit Post
a robotic hopkick or another good launcher
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Liger 7
Iron Fist God
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1451
#7 “Quote” Edit Post
A stance for Jack would be awesome. And I want him to be able to shoot the opponent if they are all the way at the end of the screen. Like DJ's laser only make it a lot faster and blockable. Also easily sidestepped. I would still use it for style points.
Signature I be comin' through like the four-nine-three-eleven...
Runemaster
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1398
From: Indonesia
#8 “Quote” Edit Post
Yeah i agree on a robotic hopkick launcher..... make that a low crush as well.
OneThreeFour.
Virtuoso
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 517
From: USA Texas
PSN: OneThreeFour
XBL: UnblockableArts
#9 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Liger 7
A stance for Jack would be awesome. And I want him to be able to shoot the opponent if they are all the way at the end of the screen. Like DJ's laser only make it a lot faster and blockable. Also easily sidestepped. I would still use it for style points.


He's going to have a tackle like marduk; except he self destructs and kills both players.

Great for when the match is 2-1.
Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#10 “Quote” Edit Post
I vote for Tank Stance.

His legs fold into tank treads and he has various piston gun moves. He can also just run your ass over.

Honestly though, I kinda hope they give him a parry, or at least a move with punch parry properties like Kazuya f+2 to help him out againt quick punch pressure .

Air and ground throws would be much appreciated too. Ground throws would fill in a gap in his oki game for people who stay on the ground. Air throws would give Jack a solid combo ender for oki. f,f+2 is nice and all, but throw oki after combos would make Jack dangerous.

Ground throw from the sides he could put his foot on them to hold them down then piston fist them in the face.

Ground throw from feet he could grab them and do a "One" windup then toss them in the air kinda like Marduk's ground grab. It could give him the same options as his d/f+2+4 throw, or just skip the comboability and do some damage.

Head ground grab should be like Asta'a SC2 grab where he slams their head into the ground then picks them up to leave them standing with you at + frames. That would be fucking awesome.

Air 1+3 could be Jack-2's TTT side throw where he folds you in half.

Air 2+4 could be some sort of tossaway like P.Jack's TTT spinny side throw, or just a grab like u/f+1+2 where he holds you then he piston guns them across the screen to position near the wall.

u/f+1+2 in the air could have Jack grab them and do some sort of slamdown similar to Marduk's 1+3 aithrow, grab then slam down FDFT with an animation kind like his b+1.


Also, some additions/tweaks that I would like to see:
-Fix f+1_2,1 so that you can't instantly SS everything off the block.

-Fix the hitboxes on d/f+1+2 so that if the first hit connects, the second hit always connects. I hate hitting a grounded opponent with it that just moved, making the 2nd hit whiff and get stuck in the ground. Or at least make the 2nd hit whiffed not leave you at like -50. Also, it would be sweet to make a full grounded hit an attack throw that picks up the opponent and then shoots them away like his d+2+4 crouch throw.

-Up the damage on d/f+1+3,1+2. It does 35 as is, which is pretty weak considering that it's not the easiest move to land. Just like 5-10 extra points of damage would be nice. Or maybe tweak it so that it is easier to land, and give it a mixup like Marduk's tackle.

-Slightly better tracking on WR_f,f,f+2. I don't think it needs to track 100% or anything like that, but it whiffs a lot due to very,very poor tracking.

-Better grounded tracking on f,f+3. Especially if they don't give him a ground throw.

-FC throw. Maybe even just give him the ground grabs and have them do a Nightmare-style flapjack on a standing opponent (FC,d/b+1+3_2+4).

*sigh*

Wishful thinking.

Last edited by Brahma on Feb 19th, 2007 at 22:33

Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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Gemini Knight
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1415
From: USA Florida
PSN: Gemini_Knight05
XBL: To Be Announced....
#11 “Quote” Edit Post
What? No Super Armor request? If Bryan can pull out a shotgun, Jack should at least be bulletproof.

Clock Up should return....
combot-killer
Former staff member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6146
From: Netherlands
PSN: X-Flame
#12 “Quote” Edit Post
ground throw
air throw
more throws
and I'm happy.

-peace-
Signature Originally posted by USMCOgre
I see that RMK FendRhodes tried to answer your question, which is funny because he has neither a wife nor any life experience with anything other than working at wal mart. I just put him on ignore so I can't see what he said, but I'm sure it's a stupid one line fail at being funny.


Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#13 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Gemini Knight
What? No Super Armor request? If Bryan can pull out a shotgun, Jack should at least be bulletproof.

Clock Up should return....


Haha, the first thing I thought of when I was posting that was Super Armor, but the more I think about it the more broke it could end up being.

I do like the idea of bulletproof Jack though, kinda like how he auto dodges laseers and shit. If Bryan shoots him he should do the clock up animation and the shot ricochets off him and hits Bryan while Jack laughs.

1+4 Clock up would be nice though. Just have it do a short stun and leave you at +8 or something.

Oh, and bring back 3+4>3+4!
Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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combot-killer
Former staff member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6146
From: Netherlands
PSN: X-Flame
#14 “Quote” Edit Post
b2, when out of range, he could shoot like a missile or something.

b,f1
f,b1
b,b1
ub_u_u/f1
cd1
f,b2
b,b2
cd2
all of these haven't been used either, so we'll have plenty options for new punch moves.

-peace-
Signature Originally posted by USMCOgre
I see that RMK FendRhodes tried to answer your question, which is funny because he has neither a wife nor any life experience with anything other than working at wal mart. I just put him on ignore so I can't see what he said, but I'm sure it's a stupid one line fail at being funny.


Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#15 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by combot-killer
b2, when out of range, he could shoot like a missile or something.

b,f1
f,b1
b,b1
ub_u_u/f1
cd1
f,b2
b,b2
cd2
all of these haven't been used either, so we'll have plenty options for new punch moves.

-peace-


Ranged b+2 = Rocket Punch!

I wish they would change the current f,f+1 move to a b,f+1 notation. The f,f+1 command makes it seem like it should have range.

Jack crouchdash? That would be scary. Wavedash into oki options.
Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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combot-killer
Former staff member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6146
From: Netherlands
PSN: X-Flame
#16 “Quote” Edit Post
I vote for f,f1+4 grab: he grabs the opponent, squeeses him really hard, then blows up. instant death. kinda like Yoshi's f,F1+4.

-peace-
Signature Originally posted by USMCOgre
I see that RMK FendRhodes tried to answer your question, which is funny because he has neither a wife nor any life experience with anything other than working at wal mart. I just put him on ignore so I can't see what he said, but I'm sure it's a stupid one line fail at being funny.


Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#17 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by combot-killer
I vote for f,f1+4 grab: he grabs the opponent, squeeses him really hard, then blows up. instant death. kinda like Yoshi's f,F1+4.

-peace-


Fuck that, f,f+1+4 makes him grab the opponent with one hand and then rocket skate across the arena and slam them into the wall, Rugal style. If there are no walls, he rocket skates then launches into the air like DJ CD+1~u/f, then does a super spinning robo-piledriver.
Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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TGS
Expert
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 141
From: USA California
XBL: TGS Fuzzy Guard
#18 “Quote” Edit Post
Fuck that; give Jack-6 a Flight Mode stance like Sentinel in MvC2. Can you say "Curb Stompin"?
Signature SF4 has enlightened me to the fact that TTT2 is a much better game.
umlaut
Champion
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 274
#19 “Quote” Edit Post
Dang, now that it has been more or less confirmed that customizable items can be used in gameplay,which of jack's toys will be my weapon of choice? The shoulder turrets? The gatling gun? some uber-cannon we have yet to see? I can't wait!!
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Brahma
Bottom Tier Hero
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10044
From: USA California
PSN: BrahmaDDT
#20 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by umlaut
Dang, now that it has been more or less confirmed that customizable items can be used in gameplay,which of jack's toys will be my weapon of choice? The shoulder turrets? The gatling gun? some uber-cannon we have yet to see? I can't wait!!


It's hardly been confirmed, but my choice is the crane arm. He should have a throw where he holds the opponent the donks them on the head with it.

A flight mode would bee cool though. Like Yoshi's DGF.
Signature Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.

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