Jack-7 FR Stuff

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Michin Nom
Legend
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 504
#1 “Quote” Edit Post
d/f+1,1 is a screw attack move. It's a m,m and -10 on block. He can finally combo off all of his launchers now.

d/b+2 doesn't KND on hit and is launch punishable on block.
Oath_Of_Revenge
War Lord
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 779
From: Italy
PSN: Oath_of_Revenge
#2 “Quote” Edit Post
right uppercut, f+4, d/f+1,1 works as a staple
That would be weird if this "right uppercut" is his d/f+2, only normal 4 used to hit after a really close d/f+2.

d/b+1 does less damage and it's basically safe (-10 and the generic uppercut doesn't reach to punish it).
He already had d+4 for a safe low, d/b+1 was only -12 and it was good for stacking damage. It's not like you get d/b+1 blocked and punished a lot anyway, and in a game with lowparries this strong this is definitely a nerf imo.

Source: https://twitter.com/YOUKYSG/status/743674785343823873

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I still don't understand the change to d/b+2 at all (no KND but still launchable), but it's not like it's the first time the balance team proved itself incompetent.
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Kane
Lucky Lili
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 13359
From: North Korea
PSN: emily_rochefort
#3 “Quote” Edit Post
right upper is what they call df2.

and yes it works as a staple, at least on claudio bc that's who I tested it on.

if u check the tweet replies, YOU made a mistake [all the changes he wrote down, he wrote them from our tz loc test thread]. it's actually b1, not db1.



I don't get the db2 change either and I imagine it will be changed by the final release.
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Originally posted by Lukmendes
I honestly wonder if Kane has a list of "Why Lili sucks" on his computer, to avoid having to write the same things over and over again .
Michin Nom
Legend
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 504
#4 “Quote” Edit Post
If they don't change the d/b+2 in the final version then I hope they make the CH version similar to P. Jack's d/b+[2] from Tag 2.
Oath_Of_Revenge
War Lord
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 779
From: Italy
PSN: Oath_of_Revenge
#5 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Kane
right upper is what they call df2.

and yes it works as a staple, at least on claudio bc that's who I tested it on.

if u check the tweet replies, YOU made a mistake [all the changes he wrote down, he wrote them from our tz loc test thread]. it's actually b1, not db1.
I blame japanese working so bad with translators and Twitter using Bing to translate, KYSG's answer to your tweet got translated as "Jack 1 LP, not 4 LP's." lol

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Since it was you who tested him, I hope you will answer some questions I have

- What does b+1 it look like? What about its speed? Is the old b+1,1 string gone?

- Does d/f+2 launch higher? f+4 hitting at normal range is weird to me.

- What does d/f+1,1 look like? Is it reliable if the d/f+1 hits at tip range? Is its recovery good enough to dash f+4 as always?
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Kane
Lucky Lili
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 13359
From: North Korea
PSN: emily_rochefort
#6 “Quote” Edit Post
b11 is gone

b1 is a left uppercut that ... almost looks like his df2, but not so exaggerated. I really don't see a use for it tbh. on a floating opponent, it flips them over the exact same way as ff2 ... but less dmg. it's -10, easy to punish and nothing special on CH.

I don't feel like df2 launches higher. iirc, df2, f4 worked in t7.0, but he just couldn't screw attack off it since standing 2 whiffs .. so no way to get a df3,2 or 1+2

df11 ... kinda hard to explain I guess. the 2nd hit looks kinda like the 2nd hit of 2,1 IIRC


I think df11 might work at tip range. worse case scenario, u can just use 2, ff df11. df1 picks up so low anyway, u can probably even f4, ff df11.


recovery is good. I was able to get a f4 after the screw attack ... but forgot that there's too many hits for b322 to full hit ... [df2, f4, df11,s! f4 ... f322 last hit whiffs]
Signature 💢 repping the Tekken Kawaii Brigade ( ͡ ͜ʖ ͡ ) (◕‿◕✿ ) ( ͡╭͜ʖ╮͡ )

Originally posted by Lukmendes
I honestly wonder if Kane has a list of "Why Lili sucks" on his computer, to avoid having to write the same things over and over again .
Oath_Of_Revenge
War Lord
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 779
From: Italy
PSN: Oath_of_Revenge
#7 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Kane
b11 is gone

b1 is a left uppercut that ... almost looks like his df2, but not so exaggerated. I really don't see a use for it tbh. on a floating opponent, it flips them over the exact same way as ff2 ... but less dmg. it's -10, easy to punish and nothing special on CH.
It could be useful if dash f+4, b+1 works as an ender, to get a high wallsplat. Really specific, but it's something.

Could d/f+3 hit after b+1 on an airborne opponent? Or multiple b+1s in a combo, or d/f+2, b+1, 2, 2 dash d/f+1,1... It would be fun to test them, but you know the thrill: "early 2017".

df11 ... kinda hard to explain I guess. the 2nd hit looks kinda like the 2nd hit of 2,1 IIRC
So it's an elbow.. Good, I guess. Is it interruptible on block? What does it do on hit and CH? Is it nc or ncc (or none of those)?

I think df11 might work at tip range. worse case scenario, u can just use 2, ff df11. df1 picks up so low anyway, u can probably even f4, ff df11.

recovery is good. I was able to get a f4 after the screw attack ... but forgot that there's too many hits for b322 to full hit ... [df2, f4, df11,s! f4 ... f322 last hit whiffs]
That's why I asked if d/f+1,1 would hit straight away

Sorry for all these questions and thanks for the insight!

Last edited by Oath_Of_Revenge on Jun 18th, 2016 at 12:46

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GosTanMan
Deity
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 651
From: Malaysia
#8 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Oath_Of_Revenge
So it's an elbow.. Good, I guess. Is it interruptible on block? What does it do on hit and CH? Is it nc or ncc (or none of those)?


I think it'll be an ncc launcher just like df1,2,1,2.
aviax
Blu Blazer Irregular
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1815
From: Japan
#9 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Oath_Of_Revenge
right uppercut, f+4, d/f+1,1 works as a staple
That would be weird if this "right uppercut" is his d/f+2, only normal 4 used to hit after a really close d/f+2.

d/b+1 does less damage and it's basically safe (-10 and the generic uppercut doesn't reach to punish it).
He already had d+4 for a safe low, d/b+1 was only -12 and it was good for stacking damage. It's not like you get d/b+1 blocked and punished a lot anyway, and in a game with lowparries this strong this is definitely a nerf imo.

Source: https://twitter.com/YOUKYSG/status/743674785343823873

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I still don't understand the change to d/b+2 at all (no KND but still launchable), but it's not like it's the first time the balance team proved itself incompetent.


Am I reading that tweet correctly in that d/b+1 is now a mid ("1LP (-10 mid)...")? Also, it looks like f+2 got a damage nerf.
Signature Autocrat1: "Default winning animation: Bryan punching face, minus punching just twerking"
My reply: OK, but only if they give him back his laugh and 'DIE!' during it.

handle: 六鬼袋《`》武雷庵
GosTanMan
Deity
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 651
From: Malaysia
#10 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by aviax
Am I reading that tweet correctly in that d/b+1 is now a mid ("1LP (-10 mid)...")? Also, it looks like f+2 got a damage nerf.


That has been corrected and stated as the new b1.
Framewhisperer
Kyu
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 6
#11 “Quote” Edit Post
Just came home after about 7 hours of Jack7 FR testing.

The new staple combo I boiled it down to is df+2 - standing 4 - b+1 (new move) - df+1,1 (new spin move) - deep dash - b3,2,2. When df+2 hits at tip range the combo can whif but its not common. You can go directly to df+1, 1 in these situations for complete consistency.

The launchers that did not give a full combo before, i.e. ff+1+2, df+1,2,1 and windmills all combo consistently now. The combo I use is !launch - b+3,2 - df+1,1 - deep dash - b+3,2,2. The fact that df+1 now has both a launcher and a high dmg mid extension built in makes the move very strong.

I can also confirm that db+2 no longer knocks down unless charged. This is the one and only nerf. It is still guaranteed after ff+1 hits.

Overall Jack7 is substantially buffed and has a great combo game with a wealth of usable launchers. I would also say that his RAGE game is one of the best in the game as his RAGE ART has long range and can armor through Akumas fireballs and kill him. He can also still set up his rage art with the regular Volcano Buster throw, meaning his rage art is potentially the fastest in the game as long as the throw is unbroken. His RAGE DRIVE is also fantastic as it is basically a safe, double damage debugger. This is extremely good for ending rounds. The wall splat of the extension is a little inconsistent and dependent on range though.

I would place Jack7 in the mid to mid/high tier and absolute top tier for fun and playability. I will happily main him for the remainder of T7.

*Edit* the new b+1 is unsafe and not very usable other than to set up df+1,1 nicely in combos. It does have a pretty big high crush window as far as I can tell though.
GosTanMan
Deity
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 651
From: Malaysia
#12 “Quote” Edit Post
Does the new b1 launch on counter hit?

Is df1,1 nc?

Last edited by GosTanMan on Jul 9th, 2016 at 06:35

Framewhisperer
Kyu
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 6
#13 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by GosTanMan
Does the new b1 launch on counter hit?

Is df1,1 nc?


b1 never launches.

df1, 1 is only natural on counter hit. It's a great wallsplating tool if you can surprise them with the extension though.
GosTanMan
Deity
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 651
From: Malaysia
#14 “Quote” Edit Post
I wonder if b1 is useful outside of combos.
Keeper of the CRANE
DEATH by METAL
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 13160
From: Austria
PSN: Zakillah
#15 “Quote” Edit Post
It looks like it has a pretty low hitbox, so maybe it can be used to hit people who sideroll.
On standing opponents I see no reason to use this over ff+1.
Framewhisperer
Kyu
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 6
#16 “Quote” Edit Post
b1 seems to have no use outside combos. It sets the opponent up perfectly for df1, 1 after launch so I think it was implemented simply for that. Its not really needed in combos either tbh.

It does have VERY long range and puts the opponent in a sort of stun on hit so the plus frames are probably very big. Not really a reason to use it over other moves though.
P. GunJack-2
Legend
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 536
From: USA Texas
PSN: prototypejack69
#17 “Quote” Edit Post
So I'm loving the new moves, pretty awesome that Jack took Evo. d/f+1, 1 was what Jack needed for better combos in the game. Does the corkscrew track at all? It looks like it would....?

Anyone have the low-down on new winposes? I saw one where he's running toward the screen but they pressed start, don't remember seeing that one.
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GosTanMan
Deity
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 651
From: Malaysia
#18 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by P. GunJack-2
Anyone have the low-down on new winposes? I saw one where he's running toward the screen but they pressed start, don't remember seeing that one.


He just runs towards the screen and wallsplats himself at it.
aviax
Blu Blazer Irregular
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1815
From: Japan
#19 “Quote” Edit Post
Signature Autocrat1: "Default winning animation: Bryan punching face, minus punching just twerking"
My reply: OK, but only if they give him back his laugh and 'DIE!' during it.

handle: 六鬼袋《`》武雷庵
Ketae
6th Dan
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 65
From: Finland
PSN: Kettae
#20 “Quote” Edit Post
Is blue spark EMGF actually safe?
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