Top Ten Moves

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oOo_oOo-916
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#1 “Quote” Edit Post
2,1 - +3 on block is why you would use this move. +3 is not a lot but it set ups a lot things. You don't actually want to attack after this move, it's more of a ss/ssw setup. - 2,1 into ss4/ss2 evades a lot. That's kinda how you want to use this move. 2,1 into db1/jabs is not what u want to do because better players will SS and punish. They can also duck the 1 and launch punish you. But the option of 2,d1+2 and it's only -12 on block with pushback will make them think twice

D3 - i17 standing low, and +1 on hit is why you use this move. On hit you don't want to attack, it's the same concept as 2,1 but it's a low. Has short range so should be used up close, which shouldnt be hard as it can hardly be seen on reaction.

F,f3 - mid, good range, juggle starter, safe. Only -3 on block and puts opponent in full crouch. This move is good. The ff notation is what makes this move good. Closes distance, and scares opponent. When they see the dash they wil block, so u can now mix the dash into other moves. For example d3.

Standing 3 - this is a good mid poke, at i15, safe very good range with huge hit box. This move is used to check your opponent. Better players know there is high option they can duck and launch punish you if you decide to ever throw it out. 3,2 SHOULD ONLY BE USED AS A PUNISHER. - 3 puts AO at the tip of his range on block at -7, basically same positioning on hit at +5. You don't want to attack on hit, just backdash away or SS/SSw same on block. Now if your opponent does get inpatient with you back dashing away all the time and SS'ing you are at + frames and u can smack them if they get to aggressive.

Ss4 - SS notation gives evation to linear moves, and the ss4 it self crushes highs. On
The low has good range, and speed. Knocks down and leads to a FC f2 for extra damage. I think no more than -16 on block, it might be less than that maybe -14 or 13.
But it's unsafe for sure.

Ss2 - unsafe at -14 with push back. High crushes and if you ssr it gives it Even more evasion properties. You can also tag from it to take red life. This makes top ten because its a seem less mix up with ss2.

Uf4 - generic hop kick. But AP needs this hopkick where other character have hopkicks they don't really need. What makes AO hopkick good is the option to do 2,d1+2~5 into red life combos for your partner. So when u get frame adv from d3, 2,1, standing 3 and u are for your opponent will try to stop ur backdash or ssw uf4 shuts all that down with low risk and high reward.

Df3 - this move I use only for stopping SS/ssw.-12 on block. But on hit the setups are endless. You have to enter practice mode to see what u can come up with. After df3 on hit I like to combo with d3 which flips the opponent causing a weird tech roll causing for set ups. But you can find your own set ups, the options are endless. Df3, d3 into ff n4. Will hit people who won't tech. Ff n 4 is a safe mid that hits grounded. Df3, d3 dah into db2. Will hit tech rollers if they don't block low. Hits grounded and is low.

B1,2 - very high damage for 12 frame move. One of the highest at 47dmg. Knocks down, wall splats, and has good range. It is unsafe but you can cancel the lat hit for mind games. But you don't want to

Blazing kick - this move is my anticipation move. Basically when I anticipate raw tags, whiffs, back dashes, and people who like to throw out random shit out in open field. It's unsafe but the risk is worth the reward, and u can tag out of it, which should be your #1 option. - made top ten because of damage potential, range, and taggable option for red life combos.
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
oOo_oOo-916
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#2 “Quote” Edit Post
Other good moves....

Jabs - obviously

F3,2 - both safe, knee, juggle on counter, both hits +8 And mid.

F2 - he has better mids IMHO and better whiff punish

D3+4 - whiff punish

D1+2 - high crush launch

Db2 - ground hitting low, homing, juggles on counter

B3 - same as db2 but safer, not homing and less damage but more range

Df1 - i14 elbow, +8 / -3

Df4 - i12

Db1 - FC setups

Iws1,2 - both hits safe, +frames on hit, bounds.
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
KINGofIRONfist
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#3 “Quote” Edit Post
missing

b,f+4: his best launcher, to spam out, massive damage, safe, mid, decent range, tagable

3+4: very fast homing on 16 frames, yeah its high, but its still good. wallsplats, good damage and safe

f+4: +frame mid move, use this out of dash, f,f,f+4, or out of ss, you dont have only to use ss4 or ss2, ss, mid move with +frames on hit and block is awesome

d/f+2: is as good as standing 3 as a poke and covers his other tracking side

u+1+2: good raw tag punisher, you can throw it out here and there, but dont abuse this

d+4: yeah its unsafe on hit! but its his fastes low, with a realy good range and tracking, and it never gets punishied, because of d+4,4

Last edited by KINGofIRONfist on Jun 24th, 2013 at 14:02

oOo_oOo-916
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#4 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
missing

b,f+4: his best launcher, to spam out, massive damage, safe, mid, decent range, tagable

3+4: very fast homing on 16 frames, yeah its high, but its still good. wallsplats, good damage and safe

f+4: +frame mid move, use this out of dash, f,f,f+4, or out of ss, you dont have only to use ss4 or ss2, ss, mid move with +frames on hit and block is awesome

d/f+2: is as good as standing 3 as a poke and covers his other tracking side

u+1+2: good raw tag punisher, you can throw it out here and there, but dont abuse this

d+4: yeah its unsafe on hit! but its his fastes low, with a realy good range and tracking, and it never gets punishied, because of d+4,4


Are these your top ten moves with AO.? Because That what this thread is for...
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
KINGofIRONfist
Malec
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#5 “Quote” Edit Post
my top 10:

1/1,2/2,1: jabs to throw out, 1 for the +1, 1,2 to breath, 2,1 for the +3 but realy riski

iws+1,2: very fast and safe mid poke

3,(2): mid poking tool, its not hitconfirmable on reaction but you kinda can hitconfirm it, if you know, what your opponent is doing

d/f+2: mid poking tool

f+4: great +frame mid move

b,f+4: spamable mid and safe tag launcher

d+4: in my opinion his best low poke, great range and tracking

f+2: mid, safe, decent tracking, wallsplats. good keep out tool with the push back on block

ss+4: the main reason your opponent will duck, seeing you sidestepping

3+4: one of the fastes homings in the game, long range, wallsplats and safe, downside of it, its high
oOo_oOo-916
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#6 “Quote” Edit Post
I really wished I knew how to use bf4 lol

But I never use it... I think ima start by using it after SS...


I have a question about d4....

On hit its like -14 I think.... How do you use this move against good players.???

When I use d4,4/d4>4, I get stuffed with high crush moves. Lee's d3 will stop it every time. A generic db4/fcd4 will it every time too....

So how do you use this move, because I can't use it, it's like using 3,2 imo.

*and do u have setups for bf4 beside after SS.? The range and bf notation throws me off sometimes...
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
KINGofIRONfist
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#7 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by oOo_oOo-916
I really wished I knew how to use bf4 lol

But I never use it... I think ima start by using it after SS...


I have a question about d4....

On hit its like -14 I think.... How do you use this move against good players.???

When I use d4,4/d4>4, I get stuffed with high crush moves. Lee's d3 will stop it every time. A generic db4/fcd4 will it every time too....

So how do you use this move, because I can't use it, it's like using 3,2 imo.

*and do u have setups for bf4 beside after SS.? The range and bf notation throws me off sometimes...


i only use d+4 95% of the time and i dont know, i never getting punished for it on hit. its easy one of the fastes lows in the game with awesome range and tracking. damage is shitty and frames also, but u just have to get a feel for it. i think its a good low, at least for AO lol.

b,f+4 is good after spike combos, like doing u/f+4, d/f+1, 3,2, d+1 B!, F+3,2, your opponent cant quickroll from here. so if they roll back or forward, they will get relaunched with 3,2. they cant just stay on the ground, or sideroll, f,fn4 will hit them grounded. they cant use wakeup kicks, cause u beat mid and low wakeup kicks with like everything (hopkick, b,f+4...). only "safe" option is to stand up straight and from here u have mixups (b,f+4, any low, throws).
you have to learn the input for b,f+4, so u can use it after ss and backdash cancels. i feel like, without b,f+4 i wouldnt get any wins with AO. on my double ogre team its 112 damage without wall, with wall it can get up to 145 damage.
yoloswag
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#8 “Quote” Edit Post
A Ogre has many useful moves. Top 10 in no order:

- ff,n4, good range, safe (knd on hit, forcing opponent into FC on block with pushback), tracks a little bit.
- 3+4. Fast, safe homing move (i16), good range with pushback. 2 bad it's High.
- WM. The infamous throw which leads into HUGE damage.
- f+1+2. His best whiff punisher which is pretty fast (i17). Punishes eg. deathfist. Somethimes use f+2 to whiff punish moves which have low hitbox.
- FC f+1. Mix with FC lows. Only -14 with pushback.
- FC df+2. Mix with FC mids.
- 32. 3 itself is a move which has phenomenal range. 2 is just YOLO move and good player will duck it and punish it like hell.
- iws 1,2. Annoying mid-mid string. Mix FC moves to confuse ur opponent.
- b+1,2. Best i12 punisher in the game which can be used also as an offensive tool (cancels)
- YOLOhopkick. When u are in the YOLO zone u can just throw it out. Risk/reward is in your side. Eats red life.

I really think there are only 2 moves which are bad. Other moves are good or great.

- fF+2 is pure gimmick. Even at the walls u can punish this easilly.
- b+2,1. Both hits are launch punishable and crushing it inconsistent as hell.
KINGofIRONfist
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#9 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by yoloswag
I really think there are only 2 moves which are bad. Other moves are good or great.


and still he sucks ass

he has a lot of bad moves
yoloswag
Shihan
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#10 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
and still he sucks ass

he has a lot of bad moves

Well, I think he is a solid character, prolly in mid A or upper A- tier imo. Majority of A Ogre players ranks him into trash tier but I really think he is a top 25 character. You can call me crazy but the only thing he lacks is good counter hit tools imo.
KINGofIRONfist
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#11 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by yoloswag
Well, I think he is a solid character, prolly in mid A or upper A- tier imo. Majority of A Ogre players ranks him into trash tier but I really think he is a top 25 character. You can call me crazy but the only thing he lacks is good counter hit tools imo.


no tracking, no 13frame d/f+1 poke, no good low poke (plz dont name d+3, this is not the range you want to be with his shitty pokes), no range on whiffpunishing other then f+1+2 and f+2, his 3 14frame mids are all bugged with the hitbox (d/f+1, b+4 and d+2). a lot of unnecessary unsafe moves (d/f+3+4, d/f+3, u+3, f+2+3, b+2,1...)

i tried so hard with AO, i have over 2k matches or so with him and imo he is the worst char next to dr.B name a char that is worse.
yoloswag
Shihan
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Posts: 124
From: Finland
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#12 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
no tracking, no 13frame d/f+1 poke, no good low poke (plz dont name d+3, this is not the range you want to be with his shitty pokes), no range on whiffpunishing other then f+1+2 and f+2, his 3 14frame mids are all bugged with the hitbox (d/f+1, b+4 and d+2). a lot of unnecessary unsafe moves (d/f+3+4, d/f+3, u+3, f+2+3, b+2,1...)

i tried so hard with AO, i have over 2k matches or so with him and imo he is the worst char next to dr.B name a char that is worse.

imo df+1 in general are not good as they are used to be. That being said, df+1 isn't worth the risk. His df+1 is okay becuase of frames. Yea sure it's 14 frames but on block it's -3 only and +8 on hit. It doesn't track but the range is same as eg. Armor Kings df+1. But df+1,2 is a counter hit string which leads into huge damage for df+1. df+1,2 does 38 on counter hit.

Armor King's CH df+1 do 19 dmg. 38 DMG <-> 19 DMG. Armor Kings df+1 does track 2 his left, Ogres does not.
Armor Kings df+1 is 1 frame faster. i13 -> i14
Armor Kings df+1 crushes highs everythime but Ogre's crushing is weirdoo.
Ogres df+1 itself do 21 DMG, Armor King do 16 DMG.
Ogres df+1 is -3 on block and +8 on hit. Armor Kings df+1 is -1 on block and +7 on hit.

If u play online, it doesn't really matter. Online is online.

Cause he is so huge, crushing is a problem. His whiff punishing is decent; f+1+2 do 45 DMG. It's way better than Steves whiff punishing eg. bf+4 is great whiff punisher if u know how to use it properly. Blazing kick is cool if u know how 2 use it. Capital Punishment is one of the best tag punishers in the game. So there are a lot options. Low pokes could be better but they are decent. d+3 is good at close, FC df+1 is exellent, FC sweep, FC mixups, db+3, db+4 are decent also. Some moves have weird hitboxes but they aren't crueshials. eg. b+4 after the bound.
oOo_oOo-916
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#13 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
no tracking, no 13frame d/f+1 poke, no good low poke (plz dont name d+3, this is not the range you want to be with his shitty pokes), no range on whiffpunishing other then f+1+2 and f+2, his 3 14frame mids are all bugged with the hitbox (d/f+1, b+4 and d+2). a lot of unnecessary unsafe moves (d/f+3+4, d/f+3, u+3, f+2+3, b+2,1...)

i tried so hard with AO, i have over 2k matches or so with him and imo he is the worst char next to dr.B name a char that is worse.


You trippin bro...

How is df3 useless.? And d3 is not good because of what.? The range your put in after hit.? ??? Df3 is solid. Unsafe but if I know they are gonna step it will eat anything up, into crazy mix ups.

D3 is good. Tell me why it's not, and I'll tell you why it is. Same for df3.

Not In comparison to other characters though...
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
KINGofIRONfist
Malec
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#14 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by oOo_oOo-916
You trippin bro...

How is df3 useless.? And d3 is not good because of what.? The range your put in after hit.? ??? Df3 is solid. Unsafe but if I know they are gonna step it will eat anything up, into crazy mix ups.

D3 is good. Tell me why it's not, and I'll tell you why it is. Same for df3.

Not In comparison to other characters though...


i have said d/f+3 is unsafe, thats it, it shouldnt be, ancient ogre has no tracking, his fucking mid homing move, should be safe. and its possible to step and block btw.

and d3 is good but the range of the move, dosent fit AOs playstyle imo.
AZYG4LYFE
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#15 “Quote” Edit Post
You know I was thinking about d/f+1,2, I think what they forgot to do was make it launch like Bruce's old version (maybe on NH to give him a nice standing 14f launch )

Well my top 10

1. standing 3 - range keepout
2. d/b+3 - quick low from range
3. bf+4
4. b+3 - on hit for FC mixup, safety = ws+1,2, risk= ws+2
5. f+1+2 - Good whiff punish, have been using more of this lately
6. SSR+2 - Some can consistently punish this, good evasion like ooo_oOo-916 mentioned
7. WM - Good throw when used unexpectedly
8. b+1+2 - If I'm - on block but safe I sometimes use this move against aggression
9. u/f+3,4,3+4 - Strange for me to mention but if opponents NG the first hit, rest will hit (due to block stun animation), I'll play around with this more, you may be able to crush certain retaliations as it's -8
10. b+1,2 Another fast whiff punish.

Oh btw, from a certain distance f+2+3 is safe just like King's...unless I've misread somewhere AO's f+2+3 property is the same as King's (tested offline at casuals)

I would like to see some more offline AO gameplay from a variety of players at the minute I've almost lost the will to even main him (almost switched my team to Bruce/Jinpachi)

But I'll stick with him. Maybe I'll ask phantom for his insight, he's using wang/AO

AZ
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oOo_oOo-916
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#16 “Quote” Edit Post
F1+2 is good but high...does it even wall splat.?

How do you guys feel about f3+4. Man this move is sooo good for my play style.

Its a low, true high crush, hits grounded, has good range, on counter leads to free damage (I go for df1+2 untill they start quick standing to reduce damage, then I float with 3,2) on hit it is only -1, but does have a trip animation and opponent in full crouch. Of course it is unsafe. But I love this move.

I use it as a long range low poke. Something he needs.

Like of my standing 3 hits, I can throw in a f3+4.
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916
Baron West
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#17 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by oOo_oOo-916
I have a question about d4....

On hit its like -14 I think.... How do you use this move against good players.???


d+4 comes out in 12 frames, making it unseeable. A player has to react very fast to consistently punish it on hit, or be expecting it. Most players will not try, because there's a huge risk of eating the second 4 on counter hit. There's also the risk of trying to punish the counter hit version and getting punished by Ogre. The full string is ncc and it's speed makes it very easy to score the full damage. It also tracks extremely well. On paper the move looks terrible but in practice it's a very good low.

Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
no range on whiffpunishing other then f+1+2 and f+2.


I think it's funny you don't mention ff+3. I don't like for ff+3 for quick whiff punishing either, even though it's good when blocked. I'm surprised you don't mention df+3 though. I get a lot of damage off the wakes from that move and it has quite good range.

Originally posted by oOo_oOo-916
F1+2 is good but high...does it even wall splat.?

How do you guys feel about f3+4. Man this move is sooo good for my play style.

Its a low, true high crush, hits grounded, has good range, on counter leads to free damage (I go for df1+2 untill they start quick standing to reduce damage, then I float with 3,2) on hit it is only -1, but does have a trip animation and opponent in full crouch. Of course it is unsafe. But I love this move.

I use it as a long range low poke. Something he needs.

Like of my standing 3 hits, I can throw in a f3+4.


f+1+2 has speed, range, damage, and safety...it's ok that it doesn't wallsplat. The fact that there are no ff, cd, qcf, or bf motions make consistently faster than moves with those motions when punishing in open space.

f+3+4 is a match-up specific tool for me. I won't use it against Mishimas, but I'll use it alot against Zafina and Capos where it's a lot easier to score the counter hit. While it has good range, and is great on counter hit, it has no tracking. Since it's -2 on hit you have to be careful how you follow up. I will usually use ss4 instead, because ss4 has very good tracking, is just as punishable on block, and kds on normal hit. It's good if you can set-up the counter hit, but I use it sparingly compared to his other lows with more tracking.
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KINGofIRONfist
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#18 “Quote” Edit Post
ff3 is to slow to whiffpunish with and i dont know if its just me, but i have a feeling it has much less range then kazuyas and also on max range, you cant follow up with a juggle. 3,2 whiffs there. i hate that. d/f3 as whiff punish sounds interesting, never tried that one. i started using blazing kick much more on big whiffs.

i would not recommend to follow up f+3+4 on hit, it leaves the opponent in fc and he can just do a ws4. best option imo is to backdash.
Baron West
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#19 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KINGofIRONfist
ff3 is to slow to whiffpunish with and i dont know if its just me, but i have a feeling it has much less range then kazuyas and also on max range, you cant follow up with a juggle. 3,2 whiffs there. i hate that. d/f3 as whiff punish sounds interesting, never tried that one. i started using blazing kick much more on big whiffs.


A lot of people like that move, but I don't like to use it outside of wakes. The range where it juggles, you can usually just do d+1+2 which is faster, or bf4 which is safe. One of my friends likes to use it out of FC instead ofFC F+1, which is kind of odd, but seems to hit people a lot.

When it hits outside of juggle range I just go for df+1+2 or fcf+2.

I agree on ff+3 being too slow. For big whiffs Blazing Kick >>> ff+3. Even if you have fast execution Blazing kick will always come out faster.
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oOo_oOo-916
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#20 “Quote” Edit Post
Ff3 is very good. But it is for sure not a whiff punisher...

More like a big damage poke.

Using it after db1 makes sense. The opponet will just block it, or get hit trying to step or backdash. If they are ducking, then your free to do whatever.

I have been using d4 and d4>4 more now.

It's pretty dope and stops the flow of my opponents offense

I'm still iffy about f1+2. It being high is killing me for whiff punishing. Some moves leave opponets so low to the ground and in tech crouches that if I miss I would be so mad I didn't use 3,2 which will always hit and is 15frames. Keep them standing for my play style that the best option. Try can't do shit after being hit, they better just block or get fucked up even more.
Signature aka NorCal_Tekken aka lilty916

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