Jun's Top 10 Moves

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g-clef_cannon
Shihan
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 107
From: USA Pennsylvania
#21 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by MiyusRibbons
f+3 is a great ranged poke that can transition into either IZUI/GEN or her sidedash, its safe at -9 and +7 on hit/CH.


It's also a reliable juggle filler that transitions to IZU 1+2 B! or IZU 1,2 B!
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Arcylis
Destroyer
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 380
From: United States
#22 “Quote” Edit Post
im not seeing d/b+1 and its extensions on anyone's list?! Lets look at the pros and cons of this move.
PROS
second highest dmg mid poke after d/f+2 if you count that as a mid poke, 18dmg
Insane range for a mid poke, Longest range Mid poke, even more than f+3, 2.5-3 character lengths
Forces your opponent into a crouch on hit
Its an elbow so it cant be reversed/parried
Has the best tracking out of all her mid pokes
Both extensions are greatly delayable
the 2 extension is a NC that wall splats on CH for full combo (im unsure if the 2 is hit confirmable)
the 2 extension also does 2 more points of damage than b+4,2 making it her 4th highest dmg NC after d/f+2,2 and ff+2,2, and ff+2,3
the 4 extension wall splats on regular hit and launches on CH
neither the 2 or 4 extension can be stepped if the d/b+1 is blocked

CONS
its her slowest mid poke at 16f i believe
the 2 extension is -11
the 4 extension is high

I think d/b+1 is awesome, but maybe Im missing something, Looking forward to hearing everyones feed back.
Signature To all my friends past, present, and future this is the best advice you will ever receive. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." ~Modern variation of The Golden Rule. The Golden Rule was first seen written on the Mahabharata, one of the two great Sanskrit epics. This was around the year 3000BC~ The Golden Rule has been around for over 5000 years and has been assimilated by every major faith the world has ever known.
rookie01
6th Dan
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 62
From: Philippines
#23 “Quote” Edit Post
the followups have good range, but the elbow has crappy range does it?
Arcylis
Destroyer
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 380
From: United States
#24 “Quote” Edit Post
its the other way around, the elbow has insane range, the extensions have average range i guess. But extension range is irrelevant since if the first hit is blocked the second hit cant be sidestepped or backdashed.
Signature To all my friends past, present, and future this is the best advice you will ever receive. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." ~Modern variation of The Golden Rule. The Golden Rule was first seen written on the Mahabharata, one of the two great Sanskrit epics. This was around the year 3000BC~ The Golden Rule has been around for over 5000 years and has been assimilated by every major faith the world has ever known.
Jason4579
Dragon Lord
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#25 “Quote” Edit Post
Because Jun's biggest strength is whiff punishing, she wants to turtle and space properly so that you can catch any of your opponents mistakes with f+2.

When you find yourself in your opponents face, you don't want to risk doing a slow poke. Your main focus should be to get out as soon as possible. In doing this, the moves that you're most likely to use will be fast pokes that pushback and give you breathing room such as d/f+1,1 and d/f+4. Her magic 4 can also be a good option to fish for a CH.

In a nutshell, d/b+1 and it's extentions may have good range and give good damage, but Jun has much better options if she just stays back and turtles, rather than trying to rush in and go on the offensive.
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Arcylis
Destroyer
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From: United States
#26 “Quote” Edit Post
i cant argue with that...

That said, what place does d/b+1 have in Jun's game? My guess would be its perfect for maintaining pressure when you have your opponent at the wall.

In what other ways can d/b+1 be used to compliment her victory strategy? It just seems to have too many perks and almost no drawbacks to overlook this attack.
Signature To all my friends past, present, and future this is the best advice you will ever receive. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." ~Modern variation of The Golden Rule. The Golden Rule was first seen written on the Mahabharata, one of the two great Sanskrit epics. This was around the year 3000BC~ The Golden Rule has been around for over 5000 years and has been assimilated by every major faith the world has ever known.
Jason4579
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#27 “Quote” Edit Post
I've been testing d/b+1 out a bit and it does indeed have pretty decent tracking to either side, although it tracks a little less to the right.

Have you ever heard of the saying 'Jack of all trades, master of none'? This move is pretty much that. It's got decent range, damage and tracking but Jun has better moves to cover each of those points.

I suppose if you're unsure of your opponents defensive actions when they're in negative frames (let's just say -7 to be safe) then it's not a bad move to throw out there. The mid followup isn't too bad on block and won't be punished too heavily by characters with bad i11 punishers.

The high followup is so-so. It's good damage and the mid isn't complete death on block so having your opponent ducking it is about 50/50. It's not like f,F+2 where the mid is launch punishable to people will be expecting the high.

I'll just have to carry on playing around with the move to see if I can find any situations where it out-performs any of Jun's other options.
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female_only
Kyu
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1
#28 “Quote” Edit Post
1. f+2 Super awesome whiff punish into a 81 damage combo
2. d+4, 4 Sometimes for oki, sometimes good to throw out... sometimes.
3. db+1, 2/4 Mid range punisher. All I know is it punishes the Deathfist and Heihachi's f, f+2. My friends play these people a lot.
4. 2, 1 / 1, 1 / 1, 2 / Safe mix ups to toss around
5. f+1 -> 3 / d+3 / d+3 db Another mix up, moderately unsafe if I go into d+3 though.
6. 1+2 Fast, crumples on CH. Pretty safe IMO
7. db+3 Okay low to throw out sometimes after the opponent becomes scared of Jun's mids. Kind of slow though
8. GEN
9. IZU
10. Either SS+4 or WR 2, 1 / WR 1, 4, 2 / 1+2 Unsafe but it works at times
*NAKM*
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#29 “Quote” Edit Post
My list applies more to Unknown since I use her more.

1, 2~SS

F+2

D+4

D+2

2, 1, 4

SS+4

1, 3

D+3+4

B+2, 1

D/B+2
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Arcylis
Destroyer
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 380
From: United States
#30 “Quote” Edit Post
@NAKM
Im not sure if its proper etiquette to critique members posting top 10 moves, but Im going to offer my advice since I cant see the harm in that.

1,2~ss isnt something Id put in my top 10, especially at number 1 if your moves are listed in order of preference. Jun's ss transition after moves isnt a true sidestep because Jun doesnt have access to her entire standing arsenal. After a ss transition Jun only has access to ss+4, and ss+2 and thats it. Both those moves can be reversed and most any kind of immediate retaliation is going to beat out your 2 options out of ss. I think as you go up against better opponents your going to have to cut back on using this for pressure more and more. Now if you only do the ss transition after punishing with 1,2 its a different story. After punishing there is no harm in doing ss+4 every time as it keeps her pressure on and launches if they are foolish enough to try anything after eating a punisher. Bear in mind I havent confirmed if the ss transition is the same for unknown, but I assume it is. If unknown can transition into a true ss then I can see the move having real merit.

2,1,4 is another move Id toss out of my top 10. its -12 on block and the 4 isnt a natural combo so its almost always gonna get blocked. You have the 3 and the 1 extensions, but the 1 extension is super slow and the 3 is high which means any relatively quick high crush move is gonna beat out anything you do except block. If your opponent wants to play it even safer a crouch jab will punish 2,1,4 and beat out both extensions every time making this move completely worthless outside of TA wall combos in which case 2,1,4,1 is AWESOME!!

Id prolly toss out 1,3 as well. Nothing wrong with it really, just I dont see the need it when you have d+4. 1,3 is -12 on block and its only good thing is that its a ncc and it does 3 more dmg than d+4. d+4 is only -10 and it hits grounded. Also d+4 is much safer because of its speed and the fact it has no preceding move. Lets not forget the 4 follow up that does a ton of damage and wall splats. Very nice to have for those aggressive opponents.

Just trying to help^^! And I dont mean to sound hypocritical since I havent posted my top 10 yet. Still working on it.

On the plus side Im glad you have d/b+2. I like that move a lot and you dont see it much. Definitely one of her best lows.
Signature To all my friends past, present, and future this is the best advice you will ever receive. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." ~Modern variation of The Golden Rule. The Golden Rule was first seen written on the Mahabharata, one of the two great Sanskrit epics. This was around the year 3000BC~ The Golden Rule has been around for over 5000 years and has been assimilated by every major faith the world has ever known.
YoshikatYoko
Lone Wolf
Joined: Sep 2012
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From: South Korea
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#31 “Quote” Edit Post
I was a bit surprised when only a few/ or none mentioned b+4,2 , uf+3 and ff+1+2.

b+4,2 - b+4 was tracking alot to her left. HC (VERY), i13, and advantage on hit.

uf+3 - tracks a lot to the right and slightly left. Safe move, CH launch, good range and A VERY good oki after a spike.

ff+1+2 - Even though it's very slow and no tracking, It is a mixup for those who anticipate while standing from the ground. Etc WS+4 then when they rise you do ff+1+2. Plus it's safe.
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AncientOgre
6th Dan
Joined: Jul 2012
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#32 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Arcylis
@NAKM
Im not sure if its proper etiquette to critique members posting top 10 moves, but Im going to offer my advice since I cant see the harm in that.

1,2~ss isnt something Id put in my top 10, especially at number 1 if your moves are listed in order of preference. Jun's ss transition after moves isnt a true sidestep because Jun doesnt have access to her entire standing arsenal. After a ss transition Jun only has access to ss+4, and ss+2 and thats it. Both those moves can be reversed and most any kind of immediate retaliation is going to beat out your 2 options out of ss. I think as you go up against better opponents your going to have to cut back on using this for pressure more and more. Now if you only do the ss transition after punishing with 1,2 its a different story. After punishing there is no harm in doing ss+4 every time as it keeps her pressure on and launches if they are foolish enough to try anything after eating a punisher. Bear in mind I havent confirmed if the ss transition is the same for unknown, but I assume it is. If unknown can transition into a true ss then I can see the move having real merit.

2,1,4 is another move Id toss out of my top 10. its -12 on block and the 4 isnt a natural combo so its almost always gonna get blocked. You have the 3 and the 1 extensions, but the 1 extension is super slow and the 3 is high which means any relatively quick high crush move is gonna beat out anything you do except block. If your opponent wants to play it even safer a crouch jab will punish 2,1,4 and beat out both extensions every time making this move completely worthless outside of TA wall combos in which case 2,1,4,1 is AWESOME!!

Id prolly toss out 1,3 as well. Nothing wrong with it really, just I dont see the need it when you have d+4. 1,3 is -12 on block and its only good thing is that its a ncc and it does 3 more dmg than d+4. d+4 is only -10 and it hits grounded. Also d+4 is much safer because of its speed and the fact it has no preceding move. Lets not forget the 4 follow up that does a ton of damage and wall splats. Very nice to have for those aggressive opponents.

Just trying to help^^! And I dont mean to sound hypocritical since I havent posted my top 10 yet. Still working on it.

On the plus side Im glad you have d/b+2. I like that move a lot and you dont see it much. Definitely one of her best lows.
agreed, 1,2 ss is not that good. 214 is like absolute crap
Fergus
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#33 “Quote” Edit Post
No one thinks WS2,1 is good?

Safe, wallsplats, i14.
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Jason4579
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#34 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Fergus
No one thinks WS2,1 is good?

Safe, wallsplats, i14.


The second hit can be ducked, leaving Jun wide open to a launch.

It's a good punisher, but not a good idea to throw out in the open.
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Fergus
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#35 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Jason4579
The second hit can be ducked, leaving Jun wide open to a launch.

It's a good punisher, but not a good idea to throw out in the open.


Ah wasn't aware of that, thanks.
YoshikatYoko
Lone Wolf
Joined: Sep 2012
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#36 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Fergus
No one thinks WS2,1 is good?

Safe, wallsplats, i14.


WS+2 alone IS good.
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A F0xy Grampa
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#37 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by OUTBREAK_YOKO
My top 10-not-in-order moves for Jun:

1. 2>1 - i11 poke that is + +3 on hit, close range mixup-er, second hit TC and high crushes, and a very good punisher ala like Alisa 1,1.
2. db+3 - Hey, who doesn't like this move? IMO one of her BEST lows for oki, and has a very good range. -14 is not that bad (at least not for opponents who have i14 WS launchers cough Bryan WS+1) because majority of the roster can only punish with WS4.
3. SS+4 - +5 on block, leads to dangerous mixups and setups, acts as an "auto SS" move like Asuka SS+2. The move itself can be done with strings leading to SS. Furthermore, it gives a free launch on CH.
4. ff+1+2 - Great move that gives a free combo, long ranged, SAFE, meaty damage on hit.
5. WS1+2 - Yep, same as Asuka's WS1+2.
6. IZU 4,1 - Risk reward move but definitely worth the risk. It is a better move than Leo's db+4,1 because you can actually mixup and create setups because you're near the opponent of the hit area. Meaty damage, Wall splat (on some situations) and arguably tracks.
7. df+2,2 - First move homing, second bounding. Furthermore, it is a NCc, HC, advantage on hit, and the string is safe.
8. can cans - like Asuka's.
9. uf+4,3 - Essentially works magic like Alisa's uf+4.4. TJ.
10. b+2 strings - this strings make the her stances very offensive considering the very confusing hand gestures Jun makes. Definitely on top.

Special Mentions:

1. Reversal~5 - Move actually does more damage when you tag in your partner and leaving the opponent standing, so you can go for setups.
2. ff+3 - mid homing and KNDs.
3. 3+4 - safe, crushes lows, KND, force mixups and hit grounded. Too bad it doesn't track like hell.


- 2 1 is 12 frames not 11, but yeah its a pretty good 2 hit string, -6 means you can still move after its blocked.

- DB3 is -15 not -14, so its launch punishable by alot of the cast

- DF22 isnt safe on either hit and its a natural combo, not an NCc, but it can be hitconfirmed. -10 on the first hit -13 on the 2nd.

- B2 strings arent good because of the weird shapes she makes, anybody playing against Jun will begin to recognise the string and just duck the 2nd hit. B2 by itself is negative on hit, DF4 is probably better for the same kinda purpose.

-
YoshikatYoko
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#38 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by A F0xy Grampa
- 2 1 is 12 frames not 11, but yeah its a pretty good 2 hit string, -6 means you can still move after its blocked.

- DB3 is -15 not -14, so its launch punishable by alot of the cast

- DF22 isnt safe on either hit and its a natural combo, not an NCc, but it can be hitconfirmed. -10 on the first hit -13 on the 2nd.

- B2 strings arent good because of the weird shapes she makes, anybody playing against Jun will begin to recognise the string and just duck the 2nd hit. B2 by itself is negative on hit, DF4 is probably better for the same kinda purpose.

-


That post was made when Jun isn't yet tested for "consistent" frames.
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celonap
Kyu
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 2
From: Canada
#39 “Quote” Edit Post
here is my top 10 move list in no particular order

1) f+2 - crazy whiff punisher does most of your damage in the game
2) b+4, 2 - knee is safe and great for those pesky hopkick abusers
3) f+4 - safe and great way to make your opponent not to SS as long as you don't abuse it(duckable)
4) df+1, 1 - both hits are safe, NC second hit is homing... use it
5) df+2, 2 - hit conformable does really beefy damage
6) WS1+2 - great move safe on block and if it hit a CH goodbye red life!!
7) SS+4 - +frames on block and juggles on CH
8) WS4 and 4 - people tend to forget these are great moves and don't use them enough
9) d+3+4 - great low crush move almost 100% safe as long as you don't abuse and be predictable with it
10) b+2, 3 - this move gets better when people know jun's b+2, 1 strings, it keeps them honest and trains them to keep standing. it makes b+2, 1 strings usable again
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CrimsonPanther
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#40 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by YoshikatYoko
I was a bit surprised when only a few/ or none mentioned b+4,2 , uf+3 and ff+1+2.

b+4,2 - b+4 was tracking alot to her left. HC (VERY), i13, and advantage on hit.

uf+3 - tracks a lot to the right and slightly left. Safe move, CH launch, good range and A VERY good oki after a spike.

ff+1+2 - Even though it's very slow and no tracking, It is a mixup for those who anticipate while standing from the ground. Etc WS+4 then when they rise you do ff+1+2. Plus it's safe.
I was thinking the same thing.

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