TTT2 Heihachi Discussion

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AZYG4LYFE
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#1 “Quote” Edit Post
Q. What do you think of Heihachi so far?
Q.Who will you partner alongside Heihachi?
Q. Will he become a popular Mishima again?

New moves, changes etc Taken from TTT2 Forum

Heihachi
b+2: his old backfist from DR
1+2: now knocks away full screen
1,1,2: doesn't wallsplat anymore
WS+1: knocks down like his headbutt now
ewgf has an enormous hitbox, you can not sidestep or sidewalk it in either direction, it's is basically a homing move launcher now

Info from Cyrox
b2, "new" long reach mid punch. Slower than 20f, launch on CH, safe (not sure about frames), bad highcrush, seems to track very good to one side. - Does not feel like a too good addition. Doesnt hurt tho. I thought this move would overlap with f3 since they are both CH launch mids but this one is used alot less and only in "setups" regarding the range and tracking.

1+2, "new" 12f long range punisher, -12. - I think this move has been slightly nerfed since I liked the 100% success rate 15f launch punisher instead of using EWGF for close range -15 moves. But now you can punish things like getup 4's and Bryan's qcb4-ish moves which is great aswell. Slight nerf imo but not bad at all. Unlike ws1/headbutt this can be quick-backrolled so nothing is guaranteed. Not sure about CH tho but it's a punisher anyhow ...

db2 buff, ok this move is now officially SICK. Super fast, high crushes like crazy, still good + frames, insane damage. Only drawback is that it is still -15 but it's a insane move. Makes it way easier to hit people with ff2 for example.

f3, hitting grounded pretty well at the wall is HUGE imo. Since it will CH launch getup kicks and wallsplats and is only -3 on block and is a knee. It's just immeasurably good as okizeme option when the opponent is at the wall.

db 1+2 new, a 2hit mid NC move that is -13 on block and highcrushes fast aswell as it does a slight sidestep. Wallsplats and KD's. Not sure about okizeme options. - Seems decent, I havent found too many uses for it except as a panic move.

1,1,2 does not wallsplat anymore. It's a drawback but kinda suspected. Since 1+2 and df 1,2 still wallsplats it's not too bad imo. It can also be hitconfirmed like Kaz's and DVJ's from BR now.

ws1, buffed. Great move now, 15f fast. It's not insane but it's very good to have versus some moves like Alisa db4 that was kinda hard to launch even with CC 1+2. It works like f1+2 and you can get DF_df1+2_ff2_d3 etc guaranteed. DF does the most damage but is the hardest, I think ff2 is the 2nd most damage and it's very easy, df1+2 seems a little inconsistent on angles. Seems like DF are as hard on any character size ? Needs to be tested more. Also does a real wallsplat now. Still -11 or so.

f4, buffed. The only difference here is that it does not give a stupid pushback in mid anymore. So now you can actually use the +3 frames on block in mid. Awesome imo.

d2, old b2. Now gives a crumple stun on CH so you can full launch with EWGF. But can be broken by holding f. Seems easier to break. Pretty much the same, still highcrushes pretty good and seems to be +8/-8 as in BR. Not too many uses, still pretty long range, eventually a little bit less ? Needs to be investigated, but moderately since this is not really a profile move ...

bb1+2 nerfed. It seems you can't get it to be +10 anymore, and even if you could (I havent been able to)



fc df4, you still get two at the wall. Not sure about properties but they are probably the same.

f+3+4
f3+4, replaced the d3+4 stance. A small window punch parry (doesnt seem like it can parry other things), more like a sabaki really. It's a move that does nothing and absorbs a punch while neutralizing it (so a string wont continue).
You follow up with moves, 1 is a high homing move, very fast, KD's to good okizeme it feels like (they flip around) needs to be checked. Launches on CH. Also if you got the parry it's guaranteed (seems to be the best followup). I'm pretty sure you can't hitconfirm if you got a parry or not, cant delay the followups much.

2,1 is the old 2,1 from d3+4 in BR. Also guaranteed if you got the parry. Due to KD you can't get a free d3 anymore. Wallsplats. Probably still unsafe, they are force crouched. Can't charge for bluesparks anymore.

1+2 is the unblockable launcher, can be canceled by holding b. Not guaranteed after parry but could perhaps catch people off guard. High move.
Worth to mention is that the f3+4 "stance/parry" is very fast and transitions very fast.



df1_df1,1_df1,2 is still sick. You can't JF jail df1,1 anymore tho. Seems like the df1,2 HC is the same. Perhaps a minimal window harder.

b1,2 is now homing. b1,4 is gone. Has longer recovery so can't be used in juggles anymore since d1 will whiff. Still safe on block but 2nd hit can still be crouched. Can be cancled to 1+2 tho with b1,2~1+2. Not sure if the 1+2 is safe like it was in BR when cancled from moves tho. Need to investigate this.

Headbutt still works the same, as does all the other moves I havent mentioned like b4, uf3,4 , db3, 1,b2 , ff2 , HS etc.

EWGF seems to track a little bit better, but needs to be tested.



AZ

Last edited by AZYG4LYFE on Dec 14th, 2011 at 17:38

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12step
Warrior
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Germany
#2 “Quote” Edit Post
Same here:

any update on heihachi?

1. What about his 112? Still wallsplat or not. The video ive seen doesnt give me ensurance, since it was kinda far away from the wall.



2. old b+2? Ive only seen his "new" b+2 from t6br which gives a (crumble?) stun on ch.



3. 1+2 properties. Doesnt launch anymore, throws the opp. far away. looks faster though. And looks like his stomp is guaranteed afterwards. But does he have an new move to replace his 1+2 from t6? Ever since old-TP is gone, it was good to have an other "fast" midlauncher. But when they change 1+2, how am i suppose to launch someone who recovers crouching.



4. Ws-Launcher? Did he get one. ws+1 looks like there might be something guarenteed afterwards- But thats not enough. And the loss of 1+2 (in case he doesnt have any new midlauncher. Dragonuppercut? lol) makes it impossible to launch moves likes db1 from miguel.



5. Any new lows? Maybe one which can be used.



6. What do you guys think of giving him his old TP at 14-Frames.


7-EWGF buff sounds nice, but need to check it first.



Looks like they are making hei worse and worse. I dont know why they do it. Come on guys, he got younger. He cannot become worse!!!! lol





I dont know if im gonna play him in TTT2. Will play Jinpachi for sure. Maybe alongside Djin.
Signature We need more db+2s !!!!!


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PhantomXD
Raijin
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#3 “Quote” Edit Post
I'm definitely playing heihachi in tag 2. he seems like so much to play. plus my friends say hes my best mishima at of all the the 1's I use. looking forward to using him along side jinpachi cuz he seems really cheap an fun
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forest16
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#4 “Quote” Edit Post
Tekken Tag 2 Heihachi Mishima looks retarded. He should be old. Too weird. MYK said it best on the ATP podcast awhile back, maybe a year ago now, after watching the Tekken Tag 2 trailer. Plus he will probably still be in the running for the worst in the game like he is in Tekken 6 BR. Lame. Worse than diaper Heihachi? Hmm... tough call.
Cyrox
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Posts: 285
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#5 “Quote” Edit Post
Sup guys. Thought I'd post some Heihachi changes.

I havent played DR with Hei anything but I think I know what I'm talking about.

General: ss seems stronger. wd seems a bit easier (?), Alisa BD is SHIT (hahaha trollface, it's true tho).

DR b2 is back, it's a highcrush mid that seems to track completely in one direction. It's a little bit faster than f3 it feels like, and does also combo on CH. Probably more - on block than f3.

BR b2 is now d2 and seems the same.

db2 seems to be faster, highcrush better and earlier and does much more damage. Still -15 tho.

1,1,2 does not wallsplat anymore.

1+2 is now like in DR. 12 frames, faster recovery (gotta be faster to punish it with jabs than in BR) and does not launch, it just gives KD and knocks them back waaaay far. Also does wallsplat. Can be quick backrolled. Otherwise guaranteed hit ? Gotta check it out.

You cant JF jail df1:f1 anymore.

They cant techroll ws1 anymore!!! So df1+2, d3, whatever is now guaranteed. I'm not sure if you can launch with hs,n4 but I'll try tomorrow. It also gives a normal wallsplat and does more damage and I think it's 15 frames but I'm not sure. I'll check it out later.

b1,2 is now homing, and I think it has slower recovery (more negative on block) need to check this move more.

EWGF dash 1 b1,2 d1 B! does not work anymore, d1 whiffs.

ff2 f3 df4 f3 d1 B! does not work on bigs anymore, second f3 whiffs.

"My" combo does still work on almost full cast EWGF EWGF df1 bf2 d1 B! hs,hs,1

It feels like ff2 ewgf df1 bf2 d1 B! does not work anymore, but gotta check more.

EWGF EWGF EWGF d1 B! does still work.

Can still backroll catch with dash wd ff2 after 1,1,2 in mid.
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VargasTheSick
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#6 “Quote” Edit Post
Thanks for the info, keep it coming.
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Cyrox
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PSN: Cyrox1
#7 “Quote” Edit Post
Oh also, the old d3+4 stance is now a fast parry that's f3+4 and from that you can do 2,1 like the old d3+4 2,1. But it does not give a guaranteed d3 anymore cuz of pushback on KD opponent.

You can also do f3+4 1 and thats a new high homing move, very fast, that gives juggle on ch.
If you get a parry 2,1 or 1 is guaranteed. You can also do f3+4 1+2 for the unblockable launcher that was d3+4 , 1 if I remember correctly.



More coming in 1-2 days when I have played more.
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Cyrox
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#8 “Quote” Edit Post
Ok I'll do a little writeup about Hei in TTT2. Also a little bit about Kaz.

b2, "new" long reach mid punch. Slower than 20f, launch on CH, safe (not sure about frames), bad highcrush, seems to track very good to one side. - Does not feel like a too good addition. Doesnt hurt tho. I thought this move would overlap with f3 since they are both CH launch mids but this one is used alot less and only in "setups" regarding the range and tracking.

1+2, "new" 12f long range punisher, -12. - I think this move has been slightly nerfed since I liked the 100% success rate 15f launch punisher instead of using EWGF for close range -15 moves. But now you can punish things like getup 4's and Bryan's qcb4-ish moves which is great aswell. Slight nerf imo but not bad at all. Unlike ws1/headbutt this can be quick-backrolled so nothing is guaranteed. Not sure about CH tho but it's a punisher anyhow ...

db2 buff, ok this move is now officially SICK. Super fast, high crushes like crazy, still good + frames, insane damage. Only drawback is that it is still -15 but it's a insane move. Makes it way easier to hit people with ff2 for example.

f3, hitting grounded pretty well at the wall is HUGE imo. Since it will CH launch getup kicks and wallsplats and is only -3 on block and is a knee. It's just immeasurably good as okizeme option when the opponent is at the wall.

db 1+2 new, a 2hit mid NC move that is -13 on block and highcrushes fast aswell as it does a slight sidestep. Wallsplats and KD's. Not sure about okizeme options. - Seems decent, I havent found too many uses for it except as a panic move.

1,1,2 does not wallsplat anymore. It's a drawback but kinda suspected. Since 1+2 and df 1,2 still wallsplats it's not too bad imo. It can also be hitconfirmed like Kaz's and DVJ's from BR now.

ws1, buffed. Great move now, 15f fast. It's not insane but it's very good to have versus some moves like Alisa db4 that was kinda hard to launch even with CC 1+2. It works like f1+2 and you can get DF_df1+2_ff2_d3 etc guaranteed. DF does the most damage but is the hardest, I think ff2 is the 2nd most damage and it's very easy, df1+2 seems a little inconsistent on angles. Seems like DF are as hard on any character size ? Needs to be tested more. Also does a real wallsplat now. Still -11 or so.

f4, buffed. The only difference here is that it does not give a stupid pushback in mid anymore. So now you can actually use the +3 frames on block in mid. Awesome imo.

d2, old b2. Now gives a crumple stun on CH so you can full launch with EWGF. But can be broken by holding f. Seems easier to break. Pretty much the same, still highcrushes pretty good and seems to be +8/-8 as in BR. Not too many uses, still pretty long range, eventually a little bit less ? Needs to be investigated, but moderately since this is not really a profile move ...

bb1+2 nerfed. It seems you can't get it to be +10 anymore, and even if you could (I havent been able to) 1,1,2 does not wallsplat anymore so it does not yield the same results anyhow.

fc df4, you still get two at the wall. Not sure about properties but they are probably the same.

New d3+4 stance.
f3+4, replaced the d3+4 stance. A small window punch parry (doesnt seem like it can parry other things), more like a sabaki really. It's a move that does nothing and absorbs a punch while neutralizing it (so a string wont continue).
You follow up with moves, 1 is a high homing move, very fast, KD's to good okizeme it feels like (they flip around) needs to be checked. Launches on CH. Also if you got the parry it's guaranteed (seems to be the best followup). I'm pretty sure you can't hitconfirm if you got a parry or not, cant delay the followups much.
2,1 is the old 2,1 from d3+4 in BR. Also guaranteed if you got the parry. Due to KD you can't get a free d3 anymore. Wallsplats. Probably still unsafe, they are force crouched. Can't charge for bluesparks anymore.

1+2 is the unblockable launcher, can be canceled by holding b. Not guaranteed after parry but could perhaps catch people off guard. High move.
Worth to mention is that the f3+4 "stance/parry" is very fast and transitions very fast.



df1_df1,1_df1,2 is still sick. You can't JF jail df1,1 anymore tho. Seems like the df1,2 HC is the same. Perhaps a minimal window harder.

b1,2 is now homing. b1,4 is gone. Has longer recovery so can't be used in juggles anymore since d1 will whiff. Still safe on block but 2nd hit can still be crouched. Can be cancled to 1+2 tho with b1,2~1+2. Not sure if the 1+2 is safe like it was in BR when cancled from moves tho. Need to investigate this.

Headbutt still works the same, as does all the other moves I havent mentioned like b4, uf3,4 , db3, 1,b2 , ff2 , HS etc.

EWGF seems to track a little bit better, but needs to be tested.

Overall I think Hei is better than in BR. Not by far but definately better. Since most characters gets toned down and the pace seems to fit mishimas a bit better aswell and since ss seems to be a bit better, in total I think he's super awesome now.

On the note of Kazuya that I choose as my tag character, he's WAY Better imo.
I havent tested as much as with Hei but new b4,1 is awesome. db4 seems buffed, df2 and ws2 now "officially" homing, new ff2 mach breaker able to punish things such as Hei's ff2 and special abilities like being able to mash 5 (tag button) after you land a ff1+2 grab to make a special tag throw that changes character and removes some red life. Top this off with virtually no nerfs that I know of.

I think it works great.

If you got any questions at all about Hei/Kaz just ask here.

Peace out.

Last edited by Cyrox on Jul 16th, 2011 at 01:00

Signature "If you are fucking playing this game, don't play to be the bitch. Play to be the best in the fucking world." -FilthyRich
MCP
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#9 “Quote” Edit Post
How does Kazuya's b+4,1 track side walk left good enough to be used? Or maybe, can you make it track side walk left + back dash cancel, I think you know what I mean about the opponent's counter-movement to kazuya's weakness.

Is it safe on block? It's mid, high, so they can duck the second hit or not? (if it's safe and jails then it's pretty good ;p) If it's not safe on block, how is b+4 by itself? I just haven't seen the move in action so I don't know what do compare it with.
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Cyrox
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#10 “Quote” Edit Post
It's mid, mid, NC and safe on block. The 2nd hit is a elbow aswell.
Looks like it tracks to the left but I'm not sure. If they wanna step you just do a dash ewgf or df1 to track left walkers.
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VargasTheSick
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#11 “Quote” Edit Post
From what I have seen on the streams, Heihachis d,b+2 is amazing. Instead of doing the usual 19 damage, it looks like it does closer to 25 - 28, plus does have some great crush properties and quicker frames. It's not a move that can go unchecked anymore. Throwing it out even just twice a round will get your opponent scared with low hits again.
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The Game
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#12 “Quote” Edit Post
cyrox have u played any tekken before 6? Anyone on this board can tell you how much I wanted old b2 back. It has always be a great move and to see it back is great. Just need to know about how it hits. Especially on CH.
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I'm new to the game but i find that the best way to win is to use f+3 then keep on using 3+4, f+1+2 until there dead.
VargasTheSick
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#13 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by The Game
cyrox have u played any tekken before 6? Anyone on this board can tell you how much I wanted old b2 back. It has always be a great move and to see it back is great. Just need to know about how it hits. Especially on CH.


From what I have seen it stuns like Kazuya's WS+2 if it CH's. It has a lot of frames on start up though, like 20.
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The Game
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#14 “Quote” Edit Post
thats good then. It's always been slow but hella useful
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I'm new to the game but i find that the best way to win is to use f+3 then keep on using 3+4, f+1+2 until there dead.
Guerrero
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#15 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by The Game
cyrox have u played any tekken before 6? Anyone on this board can tell you how much I wanted old b2 back. It has always be a great move and to see it back is great. Just need to know about how it hits. Especially on CH.


Check 1:19, It looks like the same CH from old B+2

I'm sorry but it's been a while since i logged in here but do we actually have a thread for Heihachi's ttt2 videos? I'm really curious on how the new moves look like.. Thank you in advance
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12step
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#16 “Quote” Edit Post
1+2 unsafe and doesnt launch anymore? Biiiiiiig nerf. They finally managed to fuck him up.
112 no wallsplat anymore? Biiiig nerf
b+2? no need for it since he already got f+3, wihch is better imho
db+2 more damage? buff


I dont really see a big improvement there. How am i supposed to punish alisa when she whiffs db+3? How am i gonna launch Miguels db+1, Alisa db+4, Marduks fcdf+4 ect.?

He didnt have a ws-Launcher at all.Aand now he doesnt have a fast midlauncher. why do they do such a thing? his ws-punishement got worse imo.
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VargasTheSick
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#17 “Quote” Edit Post
Not sure if any Heihachi players are by a TTT2 unit, but I was wondering how Heihachis new parry system is ?. Never seen anyone attempt it yet.
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Cyrox
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#18 “Quote” Edit Post
Since the new 1+2 will punish some moves that was very hard to punish before I only consider it a minor nerf. Mid getup kicks, Bryan's qcb4 etc.

The new ws1 does alot of damage and is 15 frames, you also get a DF afterwards like f1+2.

db2 is soo good. Faster and very good highcrush like Vargas mentioned.

1,1,2 can now be easily hitconfirmed 100% like Kaz or DJ's. Still a big nerf tho but I dont think it matters too much, he still got df1,2 and 1+2 to wallsplat and ofc DF, b4 etc.

f4 is damn good now when even in midscreen you will always be standing next to the opponent on block with your +3 frames.

The parry system is the old d3+4. Now it's f3+4 and he does a small frame-window punchparry as far as we found out. After the parry even if you get it or not you got 3 moves. 1 which is a very fast high homing move that knocks down and wallsplats, decent damage. 2,1 is the usual 2 hit string. You dont get a guaranteed d3 anymore tho. Can't bluesparks charge either. 1+2 is the usual unblockable and it can still be cancelled.
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VargasTheSick
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#19 “Quote” Edit Post
Thanks Cyrox. I was mostly wondering how good the parry system actually is though. Is it worth attempting for Heihachi ?, whats the frame window like ?. I know Wang's parry system has a good 2 - 3 frame delay in comparison to most reversals. Out of all the Heihachi gameplay I've seen thus far, I haven't seen anyone do Heihachis parry leading me to believe it's kind of pointless.
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#20 “Quote” Edit Post
Does anyone know if ewgf, ewgf, ssr, f+3, ewgf, d+1, b! is still possible?
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