Dragunov BR punishment

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Moosetaine
meh
Joined: Oct 2008
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#61 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by BlackPriest

Steve

PAB d/f+3 ? jabs


another typo and steve df1,2 duck the last hit ws1,3_ws,1+2(not sure tho)
df1,2,1~b duck last 2 hits ws1,3_ws1+2_db3.(I think ws2 is possible if they dont go to FLk)
BlackPriest
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#62 “Quote” Edit Post
Nice, edited.

Paul will be next.

Edit:

Paul is up.

Half of the cast is done.

BP is happy!

Last edited by BlackPriest on Feb 8th, 2010 at 12:05

crazy skip
Shihan
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#63 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by BlackPriest
Nice, edited.

Paul will be next.

Edit:

Paul is up.

Half of the cast is done.

BP is happy!


ive been on most characters pages... and i see frame data... but this is the only thread that actually even has the best info for how to punish... on most characters... go BP!
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BlackPriest
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#64 “Quote” Edit Post
Thanks.

But credit should go to all the guys posting and sharing punishers in this thread too.

Leo will be next.
sandilord
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#65 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by BlackPriest
I checked the frame data again, I'm pretty sure she can't transition after f+3+4,3+4 and she's left at -11...
I think your right. I asked the local Ling and he thought the reversal hits in the 12th frame, which would mean f132 hits. Woohoo! I'll check it next time I play him offline.

On Leo, here's a start:
ws1+2=-14, I think both f44 and 41 hit.
ws2=41
df2=f44, 41, maybe even df2 (-14, maybe even -15)
ff2=jabs
f1+2=f44, 41. I tested it and if I remember right it's not launchable.
db4=ws2
db41=df2
f22=f44, 41
1211=41
1214=duck 4, ws2
uf4=41
FC,df3=ws2
b2,1+2=jabs
b21=duck 1, ws2
ws31=df2
ws312=df2
ws14=ws2
ws141=df2
ff4=41
ff43=41
ff434=ws2, probably hopkick as well
BBP(df1+2,1+2, qcf2)=df2 (first 2 hits are both punishable, but don't know how bad)

That should get you started.
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BlackPriest
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tyler2k
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#67 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by sandilord
df2=f44, 41, maybe even df2 (-14, maybe even -15)
...
ff2=jabs
...
FC,df3=ws2
...
b2,1+2=jabs
b21=duck 1, ws2
...
ws312=df2
...
BBP(df1+2,1+2, qcf2)=df2 (first 2 hits are both punishable, but don't know how bad)

That should get you started.

d/f+2 is definitely not launch punishable on block, probably just 4,1 for punishment
f,f+2 can be out of jab range, heavily range dependent
FC d/f+3 is -14, all Dragunov gets consistently is WS 1+2
b+2,1+2 leaves you recovering WS, therefore WS 4 for punishment
WS 3,1,2 final hit is high too if you want to get fancier with your punishment
All the hits in BBP are terrible on block, so you should be able to d/f+2 all of them and according to ina, BBP is -18 on block so f+1+2 would probably be a better option
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BlackPriest
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#68 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by tyler2k
d/f+2 is definitely not launch punishable on block, probably just 4,1 for punishment
f,f+2 can be out of jab range, heavily range dependent
FC d/f+3 is -14, all Dragunov gets consistently is WS 1+2
b+2,1+2 leaves you recovering WS, therefore WS 4 for punishment
WS 3,1,2 final hit is high too if you want to get fancier with your punishment
All the hits in BBP are terrible on block, so you should be able to d/f+2 all of them and according to ina, BBP is -18 on block so f+1+2 would probably be a better option


Jup, already figured this out in part (will have the list finished by tomorrow), but thanks nevertheless.

Oh and:

b+2,1+2 - WS+4 _ b+3+4 last hit
BBP - qcf+1 _ f+1+2 _ d/f+2

sandilord
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#69 “Quote” Edit Post
Whoopsie, did it from the top of my head. Thx for the corrections.
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Rival_31
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#70 “Quote” Edit Post
For Wang you put


WS+4,2 ? duck last hit and WS+2

I think you meant WS+3,2
I was thinking Wang had a move I didn't know of yet.


EDIT:
I've challenged Asuka a lot so I hope that I can contribute her punishes also.

Last edited by Rival_31 on Feb 14th, 2010 at 09:47

BlackPriest
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#71 “Quote” Edit Post
Edited, thanks.

---

Leo is up.

---

King is up.

Last edited by BlackPriest on Feb 13th, 2010 at 13:36

sandilord
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#72 “Quote” Edit Post
Leo
d/b+1+2,1 ? 4,1 _ d/f+4 on max range block _ b+3+4 last hit

I think this -11
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BlackPriest
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#73 “Quote” Edit Post
Ina says it's -12.

I retested it, I think the frame data is correct, with hit analisys on Leo stays dark the whole time.
sandilord
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#74 “Quote” Edit Post
Not saying you're (or INA's) not right, but in the Leo forums they all talk about it being -11. When I play versus again I'll check.

Edit: for when you're up to Ravens data, after df44 always use df2. It launches and if your foe attempts df443 df2 will hit Raven high in the air granting a B! juggle.

Last edited by sandilord on Feb 16th, 2010 at 08:15

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BlackPriest
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#75 “Quote” Edit Post
I'm pretty sure it's -12.

Thanks, will keep that in mind for the Raven list.
tyler2k
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#76 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by BlackPriest
I'm pretty sure it's -12.

Thanks, will keep that in mind for the Raven list.

Yeah, there's absolutely no way that move is -11. I can't see Namco doing that.
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sandilord
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#77 “Quote” Edit Post
And once again you were right BP (and Tyler). I tested it yesterday in versus and it's definitely -12. Guess I'll go and tell the guys over at the Leo forums...

btw Tyler, Namco has done waaay stranger things than db1+2,1 at -11 would be...
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BlackPriest
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#78 “Quote” Edit Post
Np, it's always good to retest moves if somebody has doubts.
tyler2k
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#79 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by sandilord
btw Tyler, Namco has done waaay stranger things than db1+2,1 at -11 would be...

Hehe, actually Namco has done a really good job with balancing BR. This goes back to my post about normalizing many of the moves and properties cast wide. d/b+1+2,1 is a really strong move, if you don't think it is, then you (the reader) haven't played against a decent Leo player. m,m NC W! that has some wonky evasive properties, does good damage, and can transition into BOK for mix ups. As such it makes sense that it's -12 on block.

With that being said, Dragunov can not d/f+2 Lars' u/f+3 and it crushes almost everything we have.
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sandilord
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#80 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by tyler2k
Hehe, actually Namco has done a really good job with balancing BR. This goes back to my post about normalizing many of the moves and properties cast wide. d/b+1+2,1 is a really strong move, if you don't think it is, then you (the reader) haven't played against a decent Leo player. m,m NC W! that has some wonky evasive properties, does good damage, and can transition into BOK for mix ups. As such it makes sense that it's -12 on block.

With that being said, Dragunov can not d/f+2 Lars' u/f+3 and it crushes almost everything we have.
I'm with you all the way. I too think Namco did a fine job normalizing. Best example is how 'our' Drag got way more versatile. And it does make sense that it's -12, but as said I see bigger things in T6 that don't fit.

I was gonna mention Lars uf3 as well as Bruce cd3 to prove my point...
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