Raven TTT2 New Moves & Changes

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yip_noob
No F*eng Wei!!!
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#181 “Quote” Edit Post
no, it's still there~ although it is only from quicksand which they can float you. other moves can be jabbed at certain timing with only qcf+2 being (close to?) 100%

I wouldnt recommend using qcf+2 as much. less damage itself, less damage juggle, more seeable.
qcf+2; db+2,1; b+4,4 B! ff n SDW 3+4~5 partner fff+1+2 is my staple atm, not worth using TA!
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tyler2k
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#182 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by yip_noob
Second example, take raven's f+3+4 and f+3+4<3+4 in a 1:1 random ratio. it is expected that a player can only launch 50% of the times. The expected punishable would be less than 50% of a launch & juggle. This is what I meant by the idea that f+3+4 is only of "theoretically" launch-punishable - the launch is only potential, but not certain. I wont go any further into this topic because it is of game-theory (note: theory )

ff+3 over a grounded opponent... in what scenarios does that happen?

I personally love theory and there's plenty of it in Tekken, but don't forget to factor in risk vs reward. f+3+4 is a launcher while f+3+4,3+4 or f+3+4,<3+4 is not. But there's two ways to approach what you meant. 1) I originally you thought a literal coin-flip of f+3+4 vs f+3+4,<3+4, but at the same time you may be referring to 2) f+3+4 hit confirm f+3+4,<3+4 if f+3+4 doesn't launch (once again admittedly I'm not sure if you can hit confirm f+3+4,<3+4 as f+3+4 isn't really a staple attack for me, so I'd have to test it).

Now in case 1, it really comes down to the timing between the attacks. Even if delayed to its maximum, is it impossible to sneak in a launcher? Or is it like Raven's FC d/f+3+4 where you can u/f,n,4 hop kick which naturally option selects the follow up? If you can sneak in a punisher, then the delay is negligible. In case 2, it becomes more interesting though, if it is possible to react to f+3+4 on hit, then I'd be willing to believe in f+3+4's ability to be used as a NH, ground hitting launcher. Then in which case the delayed 3+4 becomes the coin flip scenario, in which case you are statistically less likely to get launch punished.

f,f+3 being used manually as a trick to make the opponent feel like you blundered. Usually off forced-KND or no roll situations, I tend to test my luck near the wall, which also reduces the punishability of going for negative frame SDW shenanigans. Hell, if you aren't playing Raven like every attack can be your last, you're missing half the fun of Raven
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Shi No Kage
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#183 “Quote” Edit Post
@yip. Instead of sdw 3+4~5, fff1+2, do 3~4 for oki. It's good oki and the damage is ok.
yip_noob
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#184 “Quote” Edit Post
You can hit confirm f+3+4 delay 3+4 for sure so with that said, f+3+4 on hit should be ignored as we can confirm that we can combo in that scenario.

On block however we shouldn't always do 3+4 because in doing so the opponent would always just wait and launch. From experience I haven't been launched in between the string (not saying it isn't possible). So after confirming that f+3+4 is blocked, if we do the 3+4 50% of the time, the opponent is stuck with either tryna launch after f+3+4 or f+3+4<3+4. In the first case there is a reward if we do the followup as we get a free d+3.

So the opponent can optimise his punishment by attempting to punish after the extension (if we do it) to reduce his risk and we should optimise our strategy by doing less of the extension. Anything after this is just mind games.

Shi no kage - yea I saw that in a video, but running cross chop is more damage + red bar. Also I missed 3~4 before n got launched.. My noobness

Last edited by yip_noob on Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:29

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Mr Adam0
Dirty Ninja Tricks
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#185 “Quote” Edit Post
Now that the game is out in some places (you lucky fuckers ) has anyone found/been allowed to share any other changes not listed so far? According to Tyler b+1's range has been nerfed.
tyler2k
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#186 “Quote” Edit Post
Just to clarify, either the range of b+1 has been decreased, or the natural push back from hit stun has been increased. This makes b+1 not a B! option after an acceptable amount of hits for many T6 combos. This means that Raven must use generic TA! (1+2+5) to land longer carry combos. The problem is that A) it forces Raven to use generic TA!, which does less damage than b+1 B) it doesn't give Raven the option to B! w/o going into TA!, so regardless of the damage done, your opponent's rage will be activated.

Something, off topic, I just noticed is that SDW f,f+3+4 doesn't cross over Marduk, no matter what the distance. If I was to take a guess, it would be it doesn't land on any character with a ground stance (e.g. Marduk, Jack, Kuma/Panda).
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KNITEMAREX
Lone Wolf
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 317
From: United Kingdom
#187 “Quote” Edit Post
No prob, it just means his bnbs will need some modifications, less jabs & f,f+3s and more SDW 3+4s

Speaking of combos, someone should really get on that combo thread. Wouldn't want it to end up like his T6 thread where everything was so messy before Yip edited it a good while after
TaintedCrimson
Shihan
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 110
#188 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by tyler2k
Something, off topic, I just noticed is that SDW f,f+3+4 doesn't cross over Marduk, no matter what the distance. If I was to take a guess, it would be it doesn't land on any character with a ground stance (e.g. Marduk, Jack, Kuma/Panda).


I don't know if its completely true yet but it seems qcf 2, db2,1 doesn't pick up marduk either, I kept trying to do it on a friend in online practice mode and had him tag out to another character which I was easily able to pick up with db 2,1and went back to marduk but it still didn't work
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yip_noob
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#189 “Quote” Edit Post
b+4,4 can work on some bigs when db+2,1 doesnt

Originally posted by KNITEMAREX
Speaking of combos, someone should really get on that combo thread. Wouldn't want it to end up like his T6 thread where everything was so messy before Yip edited it a good while after


i couldnt do it until castel approved of me being a mod for raven

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Mr Adam0
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#190 “Quote” Edit Post
Is it just me or is the bb+2 parry - on block like HAZ 4 now?
Shi No Kage
Raijin
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#191 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Mr Adam0
Is it just me or is the bb+2 parry - on block like HAZ 4 now?


Yeah, nomore +on block
tigerboy79
Kyu
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3
From: Canada
#192 “Quote” Edit Post
Haven't seen this change posted anywhere:

Summon-mirage/clone is quicker to do now, by a whole summon-force.
Required button mashes while charging went down from around 22 to 17, so after charging during the first summon-force, you're ready to clone during the second, knowing you'll get the clone for sure.

This move never took dozens of summon-forces like people were saying, but it did take too long in T6.
Who knows, there might be a faster way even now!
QDogg
Manji Foot Soldier
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#193 “Quote” Edit Post
Reviving the discussion regarding f+3+4, it's mentioned that this move is delayable (f+3+4<3+4) but did you also know that you can choose to recover crouching after the second hit by holding down f+3+4<3+4~d ? It makes it seem like he's still attacking as you can go into FC df+3+4 and other mixups. It's quite seamless.
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