Tekken 7 FR - Yoshimitsu

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Kazu-Yoshi-girl
a.k.a Tenshimitsu
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2007
From: Poland
PSN: Tenshimitsu
#81 “Quote” Edit Post
Is this movie deleted? I cannot see it anymore
P.S. PreezNT, I've sent you a PM

Edit: OK, I think I saw the movie, it's on TakTak's channel. Well, Steve was a bit late with his punishment under that second high of df+1,2, and - it will be punishable rather by WS launchers, not by hopkicks. Similarly to Bob's b+2,2,4,4. At least that's my prediction.

Which doesn't mean df+1,2 is bad, far from that! It's a very good move.

Last edited by Kazu-Yoshi-girl on Jul 16th, 2016 at 20:33

Signature http://www.TekkenPRO.pl - Community of Polish Tekken Pro Players
http://www.ManjiKai.com - Shiki soku ze kuu!
...
吉光と天使光:一心同体
aviax
Blu Blazer Irregular
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1815
From: Japan
#82 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by QDogg
Hi Aviax, I have some questions if you (or anyone else for that matter) can answer/test:

Is uf+1 unparryable/unreversible (I'm thinking it is except for versus Heihachi b+1+4). Just wanted to be sure.

After uf+4 hits, can you run up and do CD+2 to catch them back rolling for a juggle (in TTT2 you could run up and do df+1 to float)? Or perhaps ws+3,2 then if they roll away or standup, CD+2 juggles?

Test the frames on while running shoulder. Is WR shoulder into Sword Flash uninterruptable? Flash guaranteed after shoulder (that'd be too good but gotta test it right)? I like how WR shoulder is not unblockable now, so you can actually turtle more. It used to bail people out just doing running shoulder, now they have to kinda mixup, and you can sword flash an opponents running attack instead of trying to sword flash an unblockable shoulder.

Inatekken shows for T7FR that df+1,2 is +13 on hit. Does he get anything free like df+4 if opponent is somewhat close to a wall (but not too close because it causes wall stun) after this hits?

Is DGF f+2 safe? 3~4~u into DGF f+2 appears to be uninterruptable.

Is Bad Breath attack range the same as T7? I haven't seen this move, they may have changed the mist range or its damage.

Does 1+2+3 stop Akuma fireball?

I'm starting to think the true purpose of ff+2:2 is to go into IND to get you to gain lifeback quickly, not so much for damage inflicted on the opponent. In TTT2, you gain 4 points of health when you go into IND from ff+2 CH, then 3 points for every sword pump thereafter. I don't know how much health you gain in T7FR, but I'd imagine health regen will be important if you use spins frequently, especially since they don't take much health in this game.

First post has been updated, thanks Noodle for your amendments. Thank you for testing as well Aviax.


Still working on some of these questions, but I have some answers.

1+2+3 - as useless against Akuma's fireballs as it is against a thrown dish of sushi. Appears to be unaltered from previous versions, otherwise.

A blocked shoulder rush makes the attacker stumble a bit, too. I think a WR+3 yields more + frames, but it is hard to say. 1+4 reaches in many cases, but it is blockable. I haven't had a chance to see if flash is a good idea after blocking a running shoulder, like it is on King, but I have my doubts.

cd+2 - I'm 98% certain this crushes highs. There is a (strange) setting in the practice mode where the CPU imitates your inputs. You throw a jab, you'll trade jabs with your opponent. I chose Kaz, got right up in his face, and threw a bunch of cd+2's. He whiffed, and I spun him around. Since cd+2 is i14, it makes sense that it wouldn't hit as a CH - Kaz has already finished his attack.

No idea on u/f+1, but I'm worried about both Jins, too. DJ's new Ogre move probably nullifies this and does damage. Part of the problem with figuring out if this is irreversible is that it's a bit too slow to be reversed by most of those that have one. Dudes with reversals usually set them up after certain attacks. In this situation, what happens is (blocked attack by the opponent), reversal attempt just as Yoshi goes into uf+1, reversal attempt whiffs, Yoshi's u/f+1 makes contact.

Noodlehead: NSS, f+3+4,d+3+4 still exists, but it still only works if f+3+4 actually hits, meaning it will knock down. If f+3+4 is blocked, you don't get the automatic sit-down, and an attempt to avoid jabs by using this will work as well (as in, not very) as it would if you were in 1SS.

Given the properties of d/f+1,2, I would be very surprised if ws+1,2 weren't also -4.

The way to keep d/f+1 a real threat is to use it by itself a lot, stringing to the 2 only sometimes. It can be very useful at intercepting dudes rushing toward you from a long way away.
Signature Autocrat1: "Default winning animation: Bryan punching face, minus punching just twerking"
My reply: OK, but only if they give him back his laugh and 'DIE!' during it.

handle: 六鬼袋《`´》武雷庵
NoodleHead
will touch u gently
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 17048
From: USA North Carolina
PSN: TastyPPJuice
#83 “Quote” Edit Post
Got it, thanks, Aviax. I wish there was a "like" feature on TZ so I could click "like" on your posts.


This is going to be a bit weird to test since not too many people have tried it... Does BT d/b+2 have a hitbox in its back as Yoshi retreat.
UltWarrior1
Kyu
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
#84 “Quote” Edit Post
Fubuki Knee and General Punishment info--Thx to Wonkey for the transcription!

http://www.avoidingthepuddle.com/ne...mbo-videos.html
PreezNT
Raijin
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 616
From: Sweden
PSN: PreezNT
#85 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by UltWarrior1
Fubuki Knee and General Punishment info--Thx to Wonkey for the transcription!

http://www.avoidingthepuddle.com/ne...mbo-videos.html


Lmao at that japanese Frozen song. Anyways sad to see that the move doesn't connect anymore. At least we got a decent S! with cd+2 and df+1,2
Signature When you can't even kill yourself -

Buff df+1,4.... FeelsBadMan

Cosmic Forge
Iron Fist God
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1140
From: USA Texas
PSN: forge76
XBL: Cosmic Forge
#86 “Quote” Edit Post
Never thought I'd have to learn iWS combos and EWGF motions for Yoshi. Better late than never I guess. (I rarely used CD+1 outside of hard read tag punishes)

Kinda glad he went back to his "roots" with some of his combos. Like flash into Flea, etc.

Also noticed Yoshi can duck fireballs in IND stance. Basically he has 2 ways to heal and troll Akuma players at range: IND~sit and MED~Sidestep. It's the little things in life...
DinoTheDonDaDa
Tekken Lord Black
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 923
PSN: DinoTheDonDaDa
#87 “Quote” Edit Post
is 60-70 damage the average for most characters? or does Yoshi have garbage combo damage again
PreezNT
Raijin
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 616
From: Sweden
PSN: PreezNT
#88 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by DinoTheDonDaDa
is 60-70 damage the average for most characters? or does Yoshi have garbage combo damage again


Still garbo damage :/ but his RD, 2 Rage arts and additional moves makes up for it this time imo. He finally has a legit combo starter in NSS with his old FCdf3 from Tekken 5 I believe. You just gotta be unpredictable and random af now that we can finally transition between his stances so his mixup game just got better.
Signature When you can't even kill yourself -

Buff df+1,4.... FeelsBadMan

Kazu-Yoshi-girl
a.k.a Tenshimitsu
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2007
From: Poland
PSN: Tenshimitsu
#89 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by DinoTheDonDaDa
is 60-70 damage the average for most characters? or does Yoshi have garbage combo damage again


Yes, still garbo damage IMO. Yoshi must hit his opponent with more moves to win.
Also, I think juggles with lots of hits and little damage are bad vs Akuma meter.

If all opponents resolve to quick pokes gameplay, it will be hard for Yoshi to do any stance dancing. It's good Yoshi just got better with punishing, at least we have an option for some decent defensive gameplay
Signature http://www.TekkenPRO.pl - Community of Polish Tekken Pro Players
http://www.ManjiKai.com - Shiki soku ze kuu!
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吉光と天使光:一心同体
aviax
Blu Blazer Irregular
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1815
From: Japan
#90 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by PreezNT
He finally has a legit combo starter in NSS with his old FCdf3 from Tekken 5 I believe. You just gotta be unpredictable and random af now that we can finally transition between his stances so his mixup game just got better.


Well, perhaps this is only semi-legit, but lots of people forget that in NSS, he gets ws+2,1,2 back, and they eat the last 2 as a CH. Until now, this stun was recoverable (so not really worth it - and it didn't help that the BT u/f+4 kick often whiffed), but the new stun allows for:

(Stun), (turn around), cd+2, f+3+4, 2, b+2,1~KIN, f+2

It's... decent...

(Randomly) Kazu-Yoshi-girl: I don't know if you know this already, but one translation of Yoshi's shiki soku ze kuu is "All is vanity," which I think is pretty damn cool
Signature Autocrat1: "Default winning animation: Bryan punching face, minus punching just twerking"
My reply: OK, but only if they give him back his laugh and 'DIE!' during it.

handle: 六鬼袋《`´》武雷庵
Kazu-Yoshi-girl
a.k.a Tenshimitsu
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2007
From: Poland
PSN: Tenshimitsu
#91 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by aviax
(Randomly) Kazu-Yoshi-girl: I don't know if you know this already, but one translation of Yoshi's shiki soku ze kuu is "All is vanity," which I think is pretty damn cool


Yes, I love this quote, digged all possible meanings. I also wonder why Yoshi uses a lot of yojijukugo in his speech? Does it make him sound cooler or something? I wonder how it's perceived by Japanese people.
Signature http://www.TekkenPRO.pl - Community of Polish Tekken Pro Players
http://www.ManjiKai.com - Shiki soku ze kuu!
...
吉光と天使光:一心同体
DinoTheDonDaDa
Tekken Lord Black
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 923
PSN: DinoTheDonDaDa
#92 “Quote” Edit Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFQDjq5HGzw

Yoshi got owned alot^

but looks like if u get the counter on df+1,2 and go into db222… you still have time to recover and continue the juggle….


Sucks for the damage tho :/ looks like its back to Oki options…. very true about the akuma matchup too, sigh

with the trash damage, i baffled about how they take away the BT2 combo from f,f+4… They make Yoshi difficult but with little benefit to mastering him lol
Cosmic Forge
Iron Fist God
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1140
From: USA Texas
PSN: forge76
XBL: Cosmic Forge
#93 “Quote” Edit Post
How does DGF 3+4 do in combos? Was wondering if this could be his version of instant shining wizard throw now? This move did nothing to juggled opponents in Tag 2, so I'm curious if it functions as s decent combo ender now.

At the very least, maybe a way to end a combo into floor break.
Kazu-Yoshi-girl
a.k.a Tenshimitsu
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2007
From: Poland
PSN: Tenshimitsu
#94 “Quote” Edit Post
IMO, in earlier Tekkens he could come back with unblocks or harakiri. Now also his unblockable damage got several nerfs, so it's not that useful anymore. If by nerfing unblocks they took away an important source of damage, Yoshi should get his standard damage a bit updated. Maybe bring back the DGF throw to old damage, maybe adjust f,f+2 justframe to have stable airthrow damage, maybe add 1pt of damage here and there to his moves... maybe.

Anyway, I think that in fact it's not Yoshi who needs to have his damage buffed but some other chars should have their damage nerfed (Akuma, Hwoarang, Bryan, etc). It's not really healthy to do that much damage Takes out the fun.

BTW, I also think they didn't nerf f,f+4, BT 2 on purpose. I think it was overlooked when working on updating hitboxes. Maybe it will come back.

Edit: Good Yoshi fight below. Sometimes he plays too much but overally solid
Yoshi

Last edited by Kazu-Yoshi-girl on Jul 21st, 2016 at 20:50

Signature http://www.TekkenPRO.pl - Community of Polish Tekken Pro Players
http://www.ManjiKai.com - Shiki soku ze kuu!
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吉光と天使光:一心同体
Setnomessej
4th Dan
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 42
From: USA California
PSN: Setnomessej
#95 “Quote” Edit Post
Hello brethren, during EVO this year, me and JFJ sat down and started testing stuff with the ol yo man.

A note that I wasn't paying much attention to 7.0 Yoshimitsu, so some of this might be old news, don't kill me.

Here's what we found: *indicates new move

| NSS |

* FC+3, old low launcher (Kunimitu's from TTT2)
2,1 is Safe
1,2,1 is Safe
FC+1,2 is SAFE (2nd hit) and +14 on hit - First hit still launch punishable
F+1+2 at least -14
F+3+4 cannot transition into IND on block anymore, not sure about hit




| 1SS/general |

* CD+2 - i14 mid, -14 on block, CH launch S!
-CD+1+2 - Rage Drive (RD!) i14 safe combo extender
DF+1 steps a lot further forward now, good punisher for long reach
DF+1,2 NC, wallsplat +13 on hit, can transition into DB+2 stone fists
SS+1 is Safe
CH FF+3 into RD! (CD+1+2) for big damage
DF+3,1 is Safe
All Kangaroo kicks now -13
DF+1+2, 2 is now -13
FF+2 is Safe
*FF+2, 2 is now a just frame to pass through
B+2,2 second hit very difficult too punish now due to increased pushback
-B+2 hitbox increased, can now do 2 (or 3?) per juggle
BT+(1) 2, 2nd hit now crumple stun on CH, not breakable
*2,2 into KIN
KIN 1,1,1 is Safe
KIN 3 always knocks down, free FC+4 after
DB+4 almost never hits grounded now
4,4,4 new S!
BT+1 hitbox increased, can do 3 per combo
FLE+1+2 launches higher for easier follow-ups




| DGF |
DGF+3 not launch punishable anymore, I believe -13
*DGF+F+2 CH launch S!
DGF+4 no longer turns them around, now just + frames and CH launch S!
-Wallsplats W!
DGF+2 launches higher up in the air
DGF 3+4 air grab reaches much lower to the floor for easier combo enders




| Nerfs |
Lost B+1+2 T_T
F+3+4 is -14 (P!)
Can no longer do BT+2 after FF+4
FF+4 combos more difficult for higher damage
Kangaroo kick to -13
DB+4 hitbox on grounded opponent



| Side notes |
Ghost sword glitch still in
Purple mist no longer stays on opponent after DB+1+2 bad breath
Rainbow drop QCB+1+2 on floor break stage is very good as you can S! after break
4,4,4 S! or CD+2 S! after SS+2 to flip them back to normal




| Punishment |
NSS (10)
1,1
2,1 safe wallsplat
1,2,1 safe string - frames after
*22 to KIN

(12)
DF+4

(13)
*DF+1,2
-NC wallsplat, +13 on hit, -2? on block. Does not jail but can DB+2 after for stone fists

(14)
B+2,2

(15)
UF+3
*DF+2

Last edited by Setnomessej on Jul 22nd, 2016 at 05:15

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LJE
Fujin
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 576
#96 “Quote” Edit Post
*fc+df12

df12 -4 on block.

Maybe it's worth using RD as 14f punisher? Can you do a screw after it?
aviax
Blu Blazer Irregular
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1815
From: Japan
#97 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by LJE
*fc+df12

df12 -4 on block.

Maybe it's worth using RD as 14f punisher? Can you do a screw after it?


Yes, you can
Signature Autocrat1: "Default winning animation: Bryan punching face, minus punching just twerking"
My reply: OK, but only if they give him back his laugh and 'DIE!' during it.

handle: 六鬼袋《`´》武雷庵
PreezNT
Raijin
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 616
From: Sweden
PSN: PreezNT
#98 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Setnomessej
Hello brethren, during EVO this year, me and JFJ sat down and started testing stuff with the ol yo man.

A note that I wasn't paying much attention to 7.0 Yoshimitsu, so some of this might be old news, don't kill me.

Here's what we found: *indicates new move


SS+1 is Safe




Thanks for testing stuff Jesse and James!

Omg... Why do I love Harada so much right now. If it wasn't Harada then the guy behind the buff needs a raise or a promotion. God bless Namco, thou giveth strength and power to the Manji Boyz. Praise be
Signature When you can't even kill yourself -

Buff df+1,4.... FeelsBadMan

Ashesfall
Fighter
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3179
From: Germany
PSN: only on PC
#99 “Quote” Edit Post
he looks really good
i especially like df12 to be 13f NC

for me he had 10f 11 punisher and until 14f with b22 nothing
(now he has a solid 13f tool like bryans df21 and jins df14)

(someone know damage numbers about 11 and df12 in FR?
Signature FahKumRam - 11/10 most badass new fighter in History of Fighting games - i bow before the TekkenTeam
- "Demon" Geese - "SpecialForce" Josie -
- "WarMachine" Bryan - "Brawler" Steve -
i vote for Ancient Ogre and Kunimitsu in Season4 - Lets GO!
LJE
Fujin
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 576
#100 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by PreezNT
Thanks for testing stuff Jesse and James!

Omg... Why do I love Harada so much right now. If it wasn't Harada then the guy behind the buff needs a raise or a promotion. God bless Namco, thou giveth strength and power to the Manji Boyz. Praise be

*giggles*

Originally posted by Ashesfall
(someone know damage numbers about 11 and df12 in FR?

Here ya go, Ash.
http://www.avoidingthepuddle.com/ne...mbo-videos.html

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