Leo Season 2 Changes

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7th Dan
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 96
From: Netherlands
PSN: Benardus
#1 “Quote” Edit Post
Well here we are. Everyone hated Leo and Namco delivered. Leo was never demonstrated to be high tier, or ever relevant in TOP 8 tournaments for 3 years straight, but Namco probably hit Leo the hardest. Here are some of hardest nerfbat hits:

less pushback on 2nd hit, easy launch punish now.
Change on CH, probably no more combo, punishable useless garbage.
-14 OB, very high risk garbage now
-12 OB, strictly for punish now
-12 OB, strictly for punish now
FC d/f+3
Change OH. No more free second low on hit. From 24 to 20 damage. They destroyed this low.

TTT2 Leo was legit better than this garbage tier Leo. Any key move she had left is gone now.

I'd rather have TTT2:
FC d/f+3
-14 OB and double low OH at the wall
CH decent combo
-1 OB mixups
+8 OH, nice tracking
+3 and solid i13 punishment, also fc u/f+1,2 was fine as well, ws+4,1+2 was unnecessary
-11 OB, +5 OH, CH launch or easy fc d/f+3, fantastic safe low, better than any version in T7

Leo was never the problem and now is a fangless, transgender, weak, unpopular character. They're better off just killing IT to free up some space for a character that will actually be picked and be effective. Atleast we can enjoy the exact same meta of Mishima's, Paul, shaheen etc. Good job Namco!
Signature Nothing comes to those who wait.
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3113
From: Germany
#2 “Quote” Edit Post
i will just add this link for drive by viewers, as your post is not the complete changelist
and VERY one sided

Leo Season 2 Movelist changes (pdf) - LINK
Signature "let me enter and be the worst nightmare for Iron Fist 7, please Heihachi" (Season 3 lets go)
- "Demon" Geese - "SpecialForce" Josie -
- "WarMachine" Bryan - "Brawler" Steve -
7th Dan
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 96
From: Netherlands
PSN: Benardus
#3 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Ashesfall
i will just add this link for drive by viewers, as your post is not the complete changelist
and VERY one sided

Leo Season 2 Movelist changes (pdf) - LINK

Irrelevant. I don't care about the minor buffs. It's about the big picture and her KEY MOVES. You know the moves that actually determine here ENTIRE PLAYSTYLE? But let's look at some of those amazing buffs!!!

ws+3,1 not being launch punishable anymore OB, that is going to be a game changer !
Her u/f+3+4 change on grounded hit will probably not work in combo's anymore, great !
Her liniear slow D+2 with some extra + frames on hit and block. Yeah that's some top tier shit right there !
QCF+2,1 buff, yeah nice, she's really going to contest electrics and claudio's f,f,f+2 now xD!

It all balances out. Mark my goddamn words. Leo will never achieve anything and be lower tier than she already was.
Signature Nothing comes to those who wait.
Lone Wolf
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 310
From: Ireland
PSN: jfgtp
#4 “Quote” Edit Post
This isn't a counter to Benardus' very angry post, just some stuff I liked from the patch;

Her BBP's are back in the game. Big damage string for combos.

her uf2~D is beautiful. uf2 high crushes, then low crushes.
An uncharacteristically evasive move for Leo (normally this kind of high and low evasion is saved for Alisa, Lars, Asuka, Noctis etc)

BOK extentions are fast enough to combo, e.g., BOK~2, uf,2~D~1,2,
I'll leave it to the combo experts to study wither this is usable and/or practical.

FCdf3, f,f+3 guaranteed on Natural Hit,

Her ws 3,1,2 string being safe now was something I felt they should have done ages ago.
Signature I'm hilarious!
Dragon Lord
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 864
From: Austria
PSN: Nightbunny
#5 “Quote” Edit Post
Leo's playstyle changed entirely, but it is so much more interesting now. The removal of ch b1 is a good thing, because finally we have to think about other (good) moves again, and the buffs line up very well.

cd 2 is so useful now, where it previously didn't give shit - now it gives almost 60 dmg on ch. Pushback on it is really nice for spacing and whiffpunishment afterwards

SS 1+2, ch now also gives almost 60 dmg + pushback to work with

ch 2+3 same thing, 60 dmg

fc df3 gives a guaranteed bok2 or cc uf3+4 open stage, so much better than before. Bok2 is better because afterwards you get a free 50/50 mixup situation

bok 1+2 is quite useful now, because the follwup is staple now. it can be used against people, who are fishing ch's against your bok mixups.

df2+3 is finally back to its T6 state, which means it is not launch punishable anymore. And open stage you can use it again because plusframes are always nice to have and the possibility of a ch-combo is a nice benefit. On hit it gives uninterruptable ws3(12) or fc df3 attempt afterwards - and guess what, both followups also got buffed. ws31 only being -10 is big for this mixup purpose.

So stop complaining about b1, forget that this shit move ever existed and start playing a new (or old T6) Leo, who has a way better neutral game now. Where every safe move will do 60 damage on CH. Hardest part with new Leo is to remove b1 from the gameplan again, because it was such a braindead move to throw out once in a while at range 2-3.

All in all:
Open stage we can use SS1+2, cd2, fc df3, df2+3 and 2+3 now. None of them made sense before.
Leo is less explosive at the wall, because of the removal of df2+3 KND, but whatever. Plus 5 on hit now into sidestep shenigans can even be more rewarding than the KND before.
Signature Oh, it's a coin!

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