Baek vs. ______

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NoodleHead
will touch u gently
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 17047
From: USA North Carolina
PSN: TastyPPJuice
#81 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by KiwE
A friend of mine plays Christie and totally RAPES me and my string use with b+2 (her evadepunch). Is there anything I can do against it? Every time I do d434~fl mixups or end with the 3 or d3 etc I'm raped. Same goes for df44~fla and finish string mixups. It's really up to the point of me wanting to throw the controller. If we just start playing the poking game it's backaway uf4 he uses - my only saving point right now is how well Baek can handle her in RLX.

Can someone help? Also, any general Baek vs Christie tips would be GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks


I have to delete the posts after urs because they are either useless information, or those moves will lead u more trouble than u would have gotten w/o them.


First of all, against Cheddies, there are some DOs and DON'Ts.

DOs:
-moves that have better forward mobilities.
-moves that are quick low that can pick Chreddies up when they recover into RLX.

DON'Ts:
-mindless Strings and cancel.
-be defensive when chreedies RLX in front of u.
-jab in return when u block an attack that does not grant a sure damage. (Ex. d/f+1,1, etc)


Chreddies are generally not exactly the best SSers, so they rely on their evasion solely from bdcs. WD and FLA WD are both excellent tools to travel forward for turtling Chreddies to cover the distance, and d/f+3 is great against Chreddies who use many b+2 and d/b+1+2 setups. On CH d/f+3, u can deal nearly 50% damage, and 70%+ on walls.

Chreddies also have many lows, and a few of them are unparriable. However, to force ur opp to use them will limit their overall low game, so do pay attention on their attack patterns and low parry if applicable. b+4 is a good move post low parry, and 1+2,4 is good if opp is by the wall for a guaranteed d+2 and excellent ground game afterward.

Many inexperienced Chreddy players would b+3,3 quite much, and d+4,3,3,3~f is a good tool to pick them up for great ground game. On other moves that end in RLX, u can mixup ur d+4,3,3,3~f w/ jump over into BT d+4 ws+4,4,4 into ws+4,4,4 juggle. Jumping over once a while will prevent the f+3+4 from the RLX to hit u. Whatever u do, do not be defensive against opp's RLX. If u are trying to block the RLX mixup, best case scenario u get to hit them grounded w/ low damage, and if u get hit, that's 40% juggles. If u are trying to do something, worst case would be u get hit by the move, but since u are in the middle of the attack, juggles will not work on u. Best case while u are doing something will be u doing juggles and taking the momentum back.

Some smart Chreddy players would also mix up their RLX w/ HSP ender instead. Make sure to keep a good spacing when they are in HSP, and d/f+4,4 when u block a HSP 4. U will see it a lot.


Remember DO NOT EVER ABUSE STRINGS. b+2 kills anything Baek does w/ his string enders and FLA cancels. d+1 is the only thing u can do to stop their b+2, and it has tiny reward compared to the risk it has. Good luck, and hope u will find this post useful.
voyteskimo
1st Dan
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 11
From: New Zealand
PSN: voyteskimo
#82 “Quote” Edit Post
A guide to Baek vs Kaz would be greatly appreciated
I just cant find the appropriate moves for him... HELP!!?
Signature Do you feel the heat? You're getting Baekd...
NoodleHead
will touch u gently
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 17047
From: USA North Carolina
PSN: TastyPPJuice
#83 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by voyteskimo
A guide to Baek vs Kaz would be greatly appreciated
I just cant find the appropriate moves for him... HELP!!?


I will see what I can do. One of the best players in MA in my area uses Kaz as his main, so I have a bit of experience against him.
----------------------------------------------------
First of all, learn to:
(Beginner Kaz)
-block 1,2,"4"
-immediately punish/launch him after blocking his 1,1,2
-block b,b+2,"2"
-block his b+2,4 and punish, or block his b+2,4,1 and launch
-block his u/f+4,4,4,4
-parry his 10-hit.

(Kaz of intermediate level)
-punish blocked d/f+2
-punish TP (ws+1,2)
-immediately jab into juggle after blocking his TGF

(Kaz of advanced level)
-fuzzy guard his d/f+1 followups
-lure him into CD+4 from mid distance (where he's got no other mid options)
-not immediately attack after his u/f+3
-not immediately attack after his 3,1>4
-SW his cd+3
-not immediately attack after you are hit w/ his d/b+3_1,2,"4"_d/b+4

W/ the amount of move he uses w/ said above, you will be somewhat able to tell his skill level, and punish accordingly.
----------------------------------------------------

Kaz is the worst of the three Mishimas in terms of offensive power. However, he dishes out the most CH damage, to the point that eating one of these would be enough to turn the game around. Make sure NOT to whiff too many moves, or link into FLA loop too much. Any his lucky CH d/f+2 will make u pay dearly. His ground game is also slightly above average: high risk/high reward. Do not stand up carelessly, or you will be eating his BT trap, or even being rejuggled into ground-game reset.

Kaz is scary in close range, but his mid range attack isn't as impressive. Most of his mid-range moves requires CD/WD movement, and even so, his immediate mid-range moves are either high (wd into EWGF, or cd+3) or low (wd into iHS). His two slower options from wd are wd~n 4,4 or wd into iws+2, which are slightly slower than the other two options, and can be dealt w/ by using fuzzy guard (d/f~b).
----------------------------------------------------
From here, I will be giving you the anti strat against an intermediate/advanced Kaz player.

As the round starts, DO NOT FLA SS, or ss attack, period. That's right, I said it. his d/f+2 is a great game-starter, and a Kaz player who's fighting Baek will use d/f+2 to start his round at least once in a 3round match. Eating d/f+2 on CH is a world of pain, and I don't think I need to say it again, lol. Cautious is the key.
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At close range, 1,1_1,2_2,2_d/f+1_f+2_1+2 is your friend. Most of Kaz's close ranges are high/mid punches, or low kicks. You can try and figure out his pattern and punch parry accordingly, or low parry his obvious lows from his custom strings. When blocking his EWGF, do not dash in and attack, because his immediate d/f+2 is almost impossible to be interrupted. If his EWGF spam is somewhat consistent, use d+3,3 since it crushes high. If his EWGF spam is EXTREMELY OBVIOUS, use d/b+4. The key to take the momentum is to use d/f+1, and to poke carefully afterward. You should focus on your short custom strings, but not to make your low obvious. If he low-parry your attack, he can juggle you from d/f+1,4. It ain't pretty to say the least.

When you are attacking w/ your custom string, do not make your high obvious. Due to the priority given to the TP, most of the decent Kaz players tend to develop the instant-duck syndrome. Eating his TP can be quite annoying, haha. Use enough d/f+1 or f+2 to keep him honest.

You will likely get nothing from blocking his 3,1>4, so just be patient and wait for other opportunities to attack. Also, if you CAN fuzzy guard his d/f+1 followups, more power to you. It will most likely stop his flow.
----------------------------------------------------
At mid range, Kaz relies on his wd movement to get in close, or his cd-related attacks. At this range, Baek's d/f+3, cd ws+4,4, and 3+4 are all quite powerful, however, none are faster than his EWGF. By following the instruction mentioned earlier about his lack of mid attacks w/ your own low parry/faster mids, you should be alright. d/f+3 beats out A LOT of his options, and because you COULD end the string w/ 4, he's most likely not going to try and punish u w/ 1,1,2. Once he eats a few CH d/f+3's, he should be very likely to be cautious on advancing recklessly. Again, EWGF spam can be dealt w/ d+3,3's, or d/b+4 if you feel lucky.

Once a while he will try and use cd+3 to close in. While it's - on block, you CAN duck it and punish w/ even nastier attacks. So it's up to you to see if you can "bait" him using it, and duck in anticipation.
----------------------------------------------------
He does not have many long range attacks, so I will not mention how to attack him in this distance. He will likely to close the gap by WDing into mid or close range.
----------------------------------------------------
When you are on the ground, DO NOT QUICK STAND IMMEDIATELY because his ws+4 will rejuggle you. Also, DO NOT QUICK STAND after he whiffs his ws+4. It's another bait! If you stand up immediately after his ws+4, he can relaunch you w/ b+2,4 cd~ws+4,4. However, if he whiffs b+2,4, you will appear behind him. It's almost likely a guaranteed juggle opportunity, and you should know what to do from there.


That's all.

Last edited by NoodleHead on Jul 17th, 2009 at 15:15

voyteskimo
1st Dan
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 11
From: New Zealand
PSN: voyteskimo
#84 “Quote” Edit Post
I LOVE YOU!!
best advice ive gotten for Baek vs Kaz ever!!
Signature Do you feel the heat? You're getting Baekd...

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