Alisa Juggles

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lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1566
From: Norway
PSN: lilleboff
#1441 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by PaulZ
Does Alisa get anything after f,f + 3, 4? It looks like it should juggle.

No, unfortunately not. They can tech right after it. If they don't tech, you get iWS+1,2 into a juggle.
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PaulZ
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jan 2007
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From: USA Virginia
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#1442 “Quote” Edit Post
Is there anything guaranteed if they do tech, other than a mid/low mixup?
lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1566
From: Norway
PSN: lilleboff
#1443 “Quote” Edit Post
Not as I know. If they tech, it's like any other situation where someone can tech.
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jftdiniz
1st Dan
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 10
From: Portugal
#1444 “Quote” Edit Post
help me with Alisa
someone can tell me combos or strategies that are based on low tricks
I am very grateful, because Alisa is not based on very low tricks and thought that you guys know something I be useful.
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PaulZ
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1047
From: USA Virginia
PSN: PaulZ123
#1445 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by jftdiniz
help me with Alisa
someone can tell me combos or strategies that are based on low tricks
I am very grateful, because Alisa is not based on very low tricks and thought that you guys know something I be useful.


Zone out and spam db3 over and over. It's +0 on hit so mix up what you do afterwards. Mix up between ws4, ws3-3, backdash, sidestep, ws1+2, and crouching f+1+2.

db4 and d3+4 both potentially lead to a lot of damage, but are slow and some people can see it and block low on reaction, and they're both launch punishable on block.
Heliotrope
4th Dan
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 48
From: Philippines
#1446 “Quote” Edit Post
how do you land alisa's multiple 1's pre bound wall carry? i cant land the third one
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PaulZ
Iron Fist God
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1047
From: USA Virginia
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#1447 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Heliotrope
how do you land alisa's multiple 1's pre bound wall carry? i cant land the third one


The trick is the small dash in between the 1's - I think she can do 2 or 3 of them without dashing if you time it right. The easier thing to do for wall carry is use d/b+2,2 after the first jab, it should carry further than all the 1's you can sneak in.
Heliotrope
4th Dan
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 48
From: Philippines
#1448 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by PaulZ
The trick is the small dash in between the 1's - I think she can do 2 or 3 of them without dashing if you time it right. The easier thing to do for wall carry is use d/b+2,2 after the first jab, it should carry further than all the 1's you can sneak in.


i see , i noticed that she cant do asuka/lili like damage but her general output is good but if you end her combos with oki damage would drop down dramatically ...
PaulZ
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1047
From: USA Virginia
PSN: PaulZ123
#1449 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Heliotrope
i see , i noticed that she cant do asuka/lili like damage but her general output is good but if you end her combos with oki damage would drop down dramatically ...


Without walls, her juggle is fairly average, around 70ish from df2. At walls, her damage is slightly weaker than average, but you can end it with 3,2. That move takes your chainsaws out and you have some great mixups with your opponent down at a wall.
Heliotrope
4th Dan
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 48
From: Philippines
#1450 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by PaulZ
Without walls, her juggle is fairly average, around 70ish from df2. At walls, her damage is slightly weaker than average, but you can end it with 3,2. That move takes your chainsaws out and you have some great mixups with your opponent down at a wall.


yeah it seems she gets her damage from poke mix ups

can someone tell me if these combos are consistent cause i really wanna do her maximum damage output
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSHPZm44cXg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrfKswbX__4


EDIT:

what are alisa's pre bound wall carries...
its seems every launcher have different fillers when it comes to her pre bound wall carry..

her longest pre B that i saw was WS 2 FLY 1,2,1,3+4 W

but her common pre bound carries i saw were

launch df 1 1,2 iws 1,2,3 W!
launch b1 ws 1,2 1 b+2,4
launch b1 ws 1,2 1 db 2,2

since i was able to play with lili's carries, i see that fillers needs to consist of three hits if you want a three hit wall carrier
and if fillers has 4 hits in it, you can only have 2 hit carry

so its like your allowed to carry the opponent with six hits

Last edited by Heliotrope on Feb 2nd, 2012 at 14:18

leonized
War Lord
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 784
#1451 “Quote” Edit Post
whats alisa's strongest wall combo for pre and post b!
lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
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From: Norway
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#1452 “Quote” Edit Post
Pre B!: W! u/f+4,4 B! 2,3,3
Post B!: W! f,f+3,4,4
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leonized
War Lord
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 784
#1453 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by lilleboff
Pre B!: W! u/f+4,4 B! 2,3,3
Post B!: W! f,f+3,4,4


question about pre b! how many hits are needed for b24 to hit? also for bf2?
lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1566
From: Norway
PSN: lilleboff
#1454 “Quote” Edit Post
I'm not sure, but I think 5 before b+2,4 (eg. d/f+2, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, dash b+2,4) and 6 before b,f+2 (eg. d/f+2, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, dash 1, b,f+2). Maybe more is possible but it'll be difficult.
Signature It's hard to be humble, when you're as great as me
leonized
War Lord
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 784
#1455 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by lilleboff
I'm not sure, but I think 5 before b+2,4 (eg. d/f+2, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, dash b+2,4) and 6 before b,f+2 (eg. d/f+2, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, dash 1, b,f+2). Maybe more is possible but it'll be difficult.


i see do you know any staple pre b! 's? aside from the ones i mentioned?
lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1566
From: Norway
PSN: lilleboff
#1456 “Quote” Edit Post
For wall carry you mean?
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leonized
War Lord
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 784
#1457 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by lilleboff
For wall carry you mean?


yes for wall carry...

i noticed that her longest pre b wall carry filler is b1 ws1,2 1 1 bf2, considering the distance bf2 carries very much like lili's d223... however, its hard as hell to do, im dashing enough to make all the 1's hit, but i almost always miss the bf2... its sucks pretty much
leonized
War Lord
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#1458 “Quote” Edit Post
^bump for the answer
lilleboff
the daoug
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1566
From: Norway
PSN: lilleboff
#1459 “Quote” Edit Post
So it depends on the distance from the wall.

Very close: launcher, 4, W!
Close: launcher, b+2,4, W!
Medium: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2,3, W!
Long: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1,1_b+2,4 or launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, d/b+2,2 W!
Very long: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, 1, b,f+2 W!

Your best and easiest option for long/very long wall carries is just to bind before the wall, like:
launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, b+4,3 B! f,f+3,4_d/b+2,2 W!

If the last hit of b+4,3 B! hits the wall or very close to the wall, you just do f,f+3,4,3 to end the juggle.
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leonized
War Lord
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 784
#1460 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by lilleboff
So it depends on the distance from the wall.

Very close: launcher, 4, W!
Close: launcher, b+2,4, W!
Medium: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2,3, W!
Long: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1,1_b+2,4 or launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, d/b+2,2 W!
Very long: launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, 1, b,f+2 W!

Your best and easiest option for long/very long wall carries is just to bind before the wall, like:
launcher, b+1, ws+1,2, 1, b+4,3 B! f,f+3,4_d/b+2,2 W!

If the last hit of b+4,3 B! hits the wall or very close to the wall, you just do f,f+3,4,3 to end the juggle.


guess your right, anyway alisa's post bound W! damage is better than her pre bound wall, so it kinda stupid, the best option i could get of the pre b! carry is the ws123 1+2 desuf1+2 B! f1+2,2 and does good damage and leaves you at des, which continues your offense since oppnent cant backdash

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