[Frame Data] Not just theory, its math

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DEZ 187
Iron Fist God
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1934
From: United States
#21 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Fhwoarang
So, if 1,2,2 sucks so bad, what's his best 10 frames punisher?



Fhwoarang: i never said it "sucked so bad", i said it was never good. the move is misleading. older players use it because of how good it USE to be & new players OVER use it, now i am just referring to overall use and not punishment.

as far as the punishment aspect, the 1,2,2 is the most damaging 10 frame punishing option but 0 on hit, the ~b added to it was +2 on hit and 1,2 was +8 on hit. 1,3 was +5 on hit, only -6 on block and it jailed. in a game where he is best played as a turtle and waits for his openings, these options were very good oppurtunites to CREATE an opening.

however this is just what i know from T6. in TTT2 things have changed, so the way he can be played will have less restraints due to him being able to have a partner, tag assault damage, etc.

this is just my opinion. respect to all my feng players
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Raijin
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#22 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Fhwoarang
So, if 1,2,2 sucks so bad, what's his best 10 frames punisher?


I'd say if you just stuck to 1,2 and 1,3 you'll be fine. But 1,2,2 tends to get me in trouble sometimes while I'm relatively ok should I use 1,2.
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OffInBed
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#23 “Quote” Edit Post
I only use 1,2,2 for the damage when I KNOW something is jab punishable. 1,2 is when I'm just trying to safely pressure my opponent.
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Chance O' Brien
Kyu
Joined: Nov 2011
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#24 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by Fhwoarang
So, if 1,2,2 sucks so bad, what's his best 10 frames punisher?


I guess 1,3 if you're talking about safe moves...
But Punisher is not to be safe - and as a punisher 1,2,2 is still good...
We talked that in TTT2 it sucks as a pressing and spaming move, unlike it was inT6
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adipati
AdvG thatgarlicguy
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: Indonesia
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#25 “Quote” Edit Post
Well, IMO, 1,3 is better than 1,2,2 since +5 on hit, jails and only 3 points of damage difference from 122.
but, you know. its habit. old habit to use 122~b for punishing and goes directly onto BT for mixup.
Namco probably think of this and decide to gives 122 -14 now.
Because Feng BT game is now more rewarding.
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OffInBed
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#26 “Quote” Edit Post
I was at NEC, I have no idea how to play arcade stick T_T


However I noticed how well Miguel and Feng combo together!

I think that I saw was

Feng's WS3, df1,df1,f3,4~5, Miguels df2,1 etc etc

For a SUPER high wall splat and tons of damage and I believe he B! with Feng's f4,3. They have suc great synergy. I'm glad I picked up miguel before Tag 2 came out lol.
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Rudy024
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Joined: Aug 2008
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#27 “Quote” Edit Post
PH just got TTT2 today so anyone who needs exact testing let me know.

BT mixups are scary now. with BTd3 giving a full launch (BTd3, ws1, 1, f4,3B!) and is fast for a juggling low.

Doing uf4, f3,4, 1, db1+2B! juggles is kinda inconsistent, especially off axis. You end up in wierd angles with the screen shifting all over the place. It is possible though.
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honkhet
Master
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 185
From: Malaysia
#28 “Quote” Edit Post
guys, db1,2 seems to have reduced +frames on hit from the vids i saw
in 6br it was +7, but now it looks like it is +4 or less...

i saw this vid when this guy did uf4 after db1,2, but got simply floated by a jab
in 6br uf4 would have launched that jab retaliation...
BlackMikeNikka!
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#29 “Quote” Edit Post
Is there any difference in the frame data for 1,1 and f1,1? Can someone kindly let me know if there is.
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OffInBed
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#30 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by BlackMikeNikka!
Is there any difference in the frame data for 1,1 and f1,1? Can someone kindly let me know if there is.


I doubt it. I think the only difference is that you can't do the 10 hit combo without f+1,1.


There used to be different situational properties for each in t6, like I think f+1,1 on the opponents back knocks down, but 1,1 doesn't knock down. That way, they prevented the 10 hit combo from happening on someone's back.


Also, I coul dbe wrong, but if you get counter hit 1,1, it's natural, but ch f+1,1 isn't natural. I COULD BE TOTALLY WRONG ABOUT ALL OF THIS lol
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yip_noob
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#31 “Quote” Edit Post
1,1 has a bigger delay window to allow for a CH setup
f+1,1 allows the additional 2 option which adds variation and there makes it more safe..
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OffInBed
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#32 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by yip_noob
1,1 has a bigger delay window to allow for a CH setup
f+1,1 allows the additional 2 option which adds variation and there makes it more safe..



So does this explain why sometimes I get CH f1,1 natural? And why CH 1,2 can be blocked?
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BlackMikeNikka!
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#33 “Quote” Edit Post
Thanks guys
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yip_noob
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#34 “Quote” Edit Post
Originally posted by OffInBed
So does this explain why sometimes I get CH f1,1 natural? And why CH 1,2 can be blocked?


what da heck?

f+1,1 is NCC?? never seen it happen before..
nor CH 1,2 blocked.

i've dealt with many cases with f+1,2,2 where f+1 hits, 2 whiffs and my opponent blocks the third 2 and punishes me. no instant duck... yet
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OffInBed
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#35 “Quote” Edit Post
Oops! I meant CH 1,1, sorry about that :/
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