Budding Fighter
^ Thanks AZYG4LYFE!
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 1606
From: New Zealand
# “Quote” Edit Post
15) Baek and the tag system

Baek doesn't REALLY fit into the tag system extremely well (not as well as Mishimas at the very least). He doesn't have a really good tag launcher. The string tag launchers are ass in open ground play and rather situational. iFLA uf+3 is a decent mid-close range whiff punisher. SS 3+4 is only good if you SS something, but is solid if hits (does as much damage as an EWGF). CD+3 is his 'electric' and primary whiff punisher (too bad it's launch punishable). If db+2 was taggable and didn't give that weird launch (combo off axis really unreliable) it'd have made his whiff punishment a bit safer and better at mid-long range, but oh well.

Red life Removal

Baek isn't like Nina/Bruce/Forest Law/Paul/Mishimas who can tag out of their primary launchers using their tag launchers right after those launchers. He can, however, tag out on the end of his combos in the following situations:
- Post B!, you can 3+4~f FLA uf+3. However the juggle has to have 4 hits before bound including the bound move; (launch) ff+4,3, dash 1, f+4,3~f,B!, 3+4~f FLA uf+3 seems to be max damage in this situation.
- staple juggle, B!, iFLA uf+3_CD+3 (strictly for tagging out in open space)
Good luck trying to do your wall combos from there though.
These examples are a lot more distance related, but:
(Launch), SSL 3+4~5
(Launch), d+3,3,n+3~5
(Launch), 4,3,3~f, FLA uf+3~5
(Launch), ff+4,3, dash 2,3, FLA uf+3~5
(Launch), 4,3,3~f, 3+4~f, FLA uf+3~5
(Launch), ff+4,3, dash 2,3, 3+4~f FLA uf+3~5
can be used as taggable wall carry. (In the above examples instead of ff+4,3 you can use 4,3,3~f, but that's obviously less damage) Though those combos are not his best wall carry by any means, tag combos and taking red life is so important in this game.
After a W!, you can do 3+4~f FLA uf+3~5 to tag out after the wall combo; ie, if you did a taggable launcher with your, you can do the following combo:
(Launch)~5, ff+4,3, dash 4,3,3~f FLA 3,3~f 3+4~f db+2 W! f+4 B! 3+4~f FLA uf+3~5 and return to the original character.
That was full red bar damage and it was pretty hellacious damage. Followups very much depending on opponent.

After TA's you can end with df+3+4 or HH (provided the TA filler pops the character up high enough) but you can also try iFLA uf+3 or dash jab, dash CD+3 to try and tag out.
In all these situations it's really difficult and situational being able to get a full wall combo.

When trying to tag in Baek though, since 4,3,3~f picks up really low (I'm talking 3-ring-circus low; too bad it's range is pretty terrible in that aspect), it's really good. He can pick up off of triple electrics (don't know why you'd want to though, triple electrics into Baek 4,3,3~f doesn't bound incredibly consistently if at all); Lars f+1+2, db+2~f, SE 3~5 etc easy. He can pick up off of Feng launch, f+4~5, which is really good (it's axis dependent though).

Tag Assault

TA Fillers
Baek's pretty versatile when it comes to TA filling. He's got options for different number of hits, a couple for a lot of hits.
uf+3,4,3 for damage (hits after a lot of hits)
ff+4,3 for pop up TA - ie easy mode airgrab followups (hits after 6-7 hits)
uf,n,3,3,3~f into stuff you can really be unique with - when you B! early (hits only post 3 hits) (use db+2 for float ender or use 1+2,4 if you have a low pick up move)
1+2,4 - spike filler for when there's too much hits; weak damage (hits after a lot of hits)
u+4,3 - stronger and easier version of ff+4,3 (hits after no more than 4 hits)
iFLA uf+3: His standard TA filler to turn the opponent from FDFA to FUFT.
At the wall:
iFLA f+3, FLA f+3, d+4,4>4 - his strongest filler, works only if one hit at the wall (requires instant b+3~f+3, so very hard; can replace the first FLA f+3 with 2,3 for easier filler but less damage); the d+4 needs to hit for 60%, and can delay the last hit for regular scaling or grounded scaling depending on how you want to end the combo.
iFLA f+3, FLA f+3, b+4 - if the B! was two hits (can replace iFLA f+3 for 2,3 for easy mode but less damage); the b+4 does grounded damage so you need a low hitting move to pick up afterward.
f+2,1,4 - a less damaging 1 wall hit string than the above one (though if you can't do iFLA f+3 quick enough this one's better because you'll then be doing 2,3, d+4,4,4 which has ass damage).
f+4,4 - if the B! was three hits
df+4,4,4 - in a BT TA situation

TA Enders
Mostly you want to end with df+3+4 whenever you can, but here are some other options:

df+3+4 - now that the hitbox is lower, it hits after a lot of things, and does unscaled damage
uf+3,4,3 - if you want to carry them to a breakable floor (requires a high float TA)
ff+4,3 - for wall carry (though you should've rather carried to the wall and TA'd then)

At the wall:
df+3+4 - again, unscaled damage is good. It requires the last hit to be a wall scaling hit and not a grounded scaling hit.
4,4 - for spike, to break through floors, only works if you haven't used up all wall hits. On Kuma/TO this is guaranteed even if you have used up all wall hits. Delay just a little to get 60%.
d+4,4,4 - on bigger characters this is guaranteed even if you have used up all wall hits. Ends at 60%.

Tag out from KND's

Whenever you get a knockdown from stuff like FLA f+4, b+4 on regular hit, 1+2,4 (if you just hit that and want to get out), df+3,4, df+3+4, f+3+4, ff+4,3, d+2, CH (d+1),4, db+2 on the side/back (it can happen on occasion, especially because of db+2's tendencies to auto SSR), 3+4, or land a f+2+3, you have the option to raw tag out safely.

There are certain knockdowns where he can get d+3,3,n+3 to float, with the possible option to tag off of it, which are:
- (f+2,1,)2 (legit combo)
- db+4 (not exactly a knockdown; full combo is possible but in tournament I wouldn't suggest risking it and tagging off of it) (legit combo)
- 1+2,4 (though you're better off doing dash 4,3,3~f if they do try and get up) (oki)

This is one of the few issues a person may have with Baek; he's certainly not as flexible as Mishimas, as far as the tag system is concerned. But he's decent.

Suitable Tag Partners for Baek
In TTT2, because the game is so balanced, you can pick Baek with anyone, really, and expect to do good damage, however, some characters are obviously better than others.
Some notes about Baek as a tag partner:
- Good user of rage.
- TA fillers are good.
- Risky play (ie can lose lots of life quick if you're getting read).
- No solid tag launcher ie red life capability is kinda shitty.
- Really good pokes outside of FLA.
- Really good offensive character (has a flow to him when you're on the offense)

Baek's netsu relationships:
Likes: Hwoarang
Dislikes: Jin
Hates: Ogre

The following:
Like him: Hwoarang
Dislike him:
Hate him: Marshall Law

Some suitable partners for Baek, taking those above points in regard, are as follows (of course these are just my opinions):
Hwoarang (or Bob as I, and everyone pre Tekken-6 call him)
If you want synergy, netsu, damage and the cool tag combo. Also, if you're playing as Team Korea, you can flow between your characters better. Plus, Hwoarang's got better tools for each situation.
Team positioning (ie who should be the point character and who should be the secondary):
Doesn't really matter; Hwoarang's got better pokes in open field, slightly better punishing (because of b+3 and JFSR) and can open the opponent easier than Baek can, which Baek's got the better movement.
Players to watch: DooHanBaek (KOREA)

raybonekilla on why Kazuya is Baek's best Mishima partner:
I like Baek with him mostly due to the fact that their styles are complete opposites compared to each other, connected simply by their ability to wave dash into mix ups. Baek is mostly going to be used to obstruct the flow or momentum of Kazuya's tedious punishment based style. His sub par poke options, and him being forced to be in risk on heavy offense makes the inclusion of Baek more a change of pace. In combos they perform remarkably well. Devil Jin and Heihachi lack the ability to travel with their wall carry attacks. It's mostly one last hit from an attack pushing them to a wall or a laser that keeps him at a distance to far to close by himself. Kaz CD+3 brings him with the juggled character to begin a wall juggle or just oki in general. Both can attain high mid 90dmg which is pretty legit considering Baek struggles with damage off the ground.
You can also play Baek with a certain Mishima flair. using CD to force ducks, etc. I enjoy iws+21. You'll rarely play a Baek approaching you this way, but I play risky.

Team positioning:
Kazuya first, Baek secondary. Unless you're REALLY feeling yourself.
Combos:/ (Kazuya is blue, Baek is red) (more combos to add to this soon)
EWGF, EWGF db+2~5 B! uf,n,3,d+4,3 CD+3
EWGF~5 ff+4,3 dash 4,3,3~f FLA b+3 B! SSL HS,1 dash df+3+4

Armor King
He's just a lesser Mishima, really (Palm Upper is similar to WGF). His spacing game is really strong. b+4:1+2 is pretty good (and looks so AWESOME), cartwheels (3+4) is so strong, and there's always Palm Upper that you can put in their face if they whiff anything for half life.
Team positioning:
Armor King point; unless you REALLY want to start on point with Baek if you REALLY want that 3+4,2 TA filler.

Paul's punishing is far better than Baek in all places (standing, crouching and whiff punishing). His damage is so good. Demoman/hopkick is a scary mixup up close (and if you're good, you can get in with Paul as well as you can with Baek). Paul's df+2 is godlike (safe, taggable launcher; df+2, qcf+1~5 into combo). His range is much better IMO. Another good thing to Paul is that he can turn pretty much everything into red life with qcf+1 after every launch (except for uf+3 and ff+3 but really, if you can squeeze that in, just hopkick). Also, his hopekick is far superior than Baek's (i15 > i20). Paul also has a i14 launcher from standing (b+3), which might be something you want to consider.
Team positioning:
It depends on how you structure your team in general. If you're a guy who wants a turtle as point, go with Paul, or if you want a pitbull as the first dude, go with Baek. Both characters have good TA options and both use rage very well (CH clean netsu'd DeathFist = 50% just saying)
Players to watch: D. Porsche (KOREA)

Ganryu is good IMO (Baek's second best partner IMO, next to Hwoarang). His punishing is good (i14 launch from standing AND crouching, i10 W!), but he's got the slowest jab in the game at i12 with his standing 1 (which is +3 on block compared to most characters' +1). His pokes are super strong (df+1, df+4,1, df+2, b+2,1), and his lows are good (df+3 and FC d+1 for pokes and df+2+3 for a heavy low). His FC mixup is similar to Baek's FLA mixup (pokes mixed with taggable launchers), but much safer (FC d+1 is safe on block, WS 1 is safe, WS 4 is safe and WS 2 is only -10 and is taggable). His whiff punishing is pretty good with bitch palm (f+1+2) and bitch clap (ff+1+2~5). His TA fillers are strong (df+4,1,2).
Some problems are that Ganny's oki game isn't as strong as Baek's in general, and that his movement in general is kinda worse than Baek.
Team positioning:
Depends. Ganny's punishing is pretty good and so are his standalone pokes, so if you want a punishing/poking character to start off, he's the one you're looking for. Baek starting does more damage, while Ganny starting gives opportunities for red life damage. Both characters can use rage well (really safe pokes + rage = happy times, plus CH b+1+2 into f+3+4 does HELLACIOUS damage on CH)
For combos go HERE

These are just my recommendations for partners for Baek. However, TTT2 is pretty balanced; everyone does hellacious damage (well maybe not Xiaoharu), and everyone have their strong points and weak points in general. Pick anyone, really (and even disregard the team positioning notes I've got above), because as long as you can find ways to make the team work, no one can stahp yew.

Last edited by Budding Fighter on Nov 17th, 2013 at 19:50